Credit Card Solicitations - Do They Creep You Out?

[Generic]

NEVER lease a cc machine
You can buy one for 300. Period. Less on up ebay (and most only take a software upgrade which should be free from your cc processor) to make them PCI compliant but you would have to do your homework. If you are correctly set up as "lodging" and not retail be careful because not all terminals work for lodging
You do not "have to" lease one, it's a choice. Like a car. You can lease it and or buy it but YOU make the choice. Don't blame the cc company for a choice YOU make
Negotiate enough and you may even get a free one.

NEVER lease a cc machine
You can buy one for 300. Period. Less on up ebay (and most only take a software upgrade which should be free from your cc processor) to make them PCI compliant but you would have to do your homework. If you are correctly set up as "lodging" and not retail be careful because not all terminals work for lodging
You do not "have to" lease one, it's a choice. Like a car. You can lease it and or buy it but YOU make the choice. Don't blame the cc company for a choice YOU make
Negotiate enough and you may even get a free one

The only set fee that I pay is $7 a month and that includes the machine. I don't pay anything else, not a per transaction fee, not a gateway fee, nothing. And so far the other companies discount rates are within 1 base point (ie 0.10%) of what I pay. Not a foreign transaction fee.
We just changed all the machines in Canada to accept EMV (Chip & Pin). I would have needed to buy a new machine. It wasn't just a software update online, they changed the physical machine. Same model, very different software. I think they changed the ROM.
While the US is rejecting EMV, Visa just announced that they are going to push it and a few US banks have started to issue EMV cards. Add into that the fact that European banks can now remove tha magnetic stripes means that the US will eventually have no choice. I have American friends who are actually yelling at their bank because they can't get an EMV card. It's so much trouble in Europe without one.
In any case, in Canada, just so you understand, the CC machine works differently now. We have to hit 1 (for sale) and then we have to put in the amount. Only then can we swipe a card. If the card has EMV, I never touch the card. The client puts the card into the handset and follows the instructions on the screen, they then put in a PIN and it authorizes and prints for me a copy that says "Verified by PIN" and a copy for the client. If they don't have EMV, I then swipe the card and process the transaction with a signature. I am protected from fraud for all transactions with EMV. There are no chargebacks. I can't fake it and the client card can't be faked. There is no duplicating the EMV chip. So, I much rather process with EMV.
At restaurants in Canada, the restaurant will generally bring over a handheld unit to your table for you to put your card in and pay. They have a button for the tip % or if you prefer you can put in an amount for the tip. The server never touches your card if you have EMV. And they NEVER disappear with your card anymore.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.

Yes, you can still process without the card. The thing is, the signature is supposed to be checked against the signature on the card. Well, with chip & pin there is no need, you can't get a "fake" signature. The chip & pin also reduce lost, counterfeit and stolen cards. All the counterfeit is magnetic stripe.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.

Yes, you can still process without the card. The thing is, the signature is supposed to be checked against the signature on the card. Well, with chip & pin there is no need, you can't get a "fake" signature. The chip & pin also reduce lost, counterfeit and stolen cards. All the counterfeit is magnetic stripe.

Here's what cracks me up about the cashier at the store asking to see my credit card after I swipe it myself...there are people who are trained, handwriting experts who hem and haw about whether or not a signature 'matches' and yet, these 16 yo kids can tell if it's 'really' my sig on the slip and not just a clever imitation.
And then there are my friends whose cc was apparently 'recreated' and used to buy tons of electronics at a store far away from where they live. They contested the charges and they were told 'we have a sig on the receipt, you own the charges.' They sent a copy of the back of their card (the sig line) and it wasn't even close to what the processor had on the receipt. 'You faked it. You own the charges.'
The cc company would not back down. They insisted my friends pay this outrageous bill. I do not know how it played out other than after awhile they canceled the card because they wouldn't trust that particular card company again.
.

Here's what cracks me up about the cashier at the store asking to see my credit card after I swipe it myself...there are people who are trained, handwriting experts who hem and haw about whether or not a signature 'matches' and yet, these 16 yo kids can tell if it's 'really' my sig on the slip and not just a clever imitation.
And then there are my friends whose cc was apparently 'recreated' and used to buy tons of electronics at a store far away from where they live. They contested the charges and they were told 'we have a sig on the receipt, you own the charges.' They sent a copy of the back of their card (the sig line) and it wasn't even close to what the processor had on the receipt. 'You faked it. You own the charges.'
The cc company would not back down. They insisted my friends pay this outrageous bill. I do not know how it played out other than after awhile they canceled the card because they wouldn't trust that particular card company again.

Well, no need to check the signature with the PIN. And only mag stripe transactions are basically at risk.
Some businesses are reluctant to change... why? Because they process the CC on the cash registers and they keep the numbers and track your purchases. Well, that's going to end and they can't do it anymore. And gone are the days of the restaurant running off with your card for 15 minutes. Or the guy who puts a skimmer in front of the ATM.
As for having my card cloned... I've had it happen with bother MC and Amex. Amex caught it, called me to tell me and issued a replacement card before I even knew it. As for MC, it has happened twice. One time they suspended the card but didn't call me and I had to call to find out why my transactions weren't working. The other time we know EXACTLY where the number was cloned from... Hannaford Supermarket in the US, owned by Delhaize Group. Their computers were broken into and they had the numbers stored, in spite of the fact that they aren't supposed to. Funny, how many companies have the numbers stored even though they aren't supposed to store them, are supposed to remove them from the database, etc.
To the US it doesn't matter what cards we take, but we very much prefer to pay in CASH now, simply because every time we have had an incident, it has been in the US. To Europe was simply take EMV cards. We have seen Americans trying to use their cards in Europe and it's usually funny/sad because you have to tell them to go see a cashier, that they can't use the automated machine, can't rent a bicycle, can't pay the meter. In many countries, the automated machines use EMV only. There is no mag stripe reader.
.

That Hannaford situtaion wasn't so much that they were storing the info as software had been installed in their data transaction system that was recording every card and every check that was run thru every machine before it was sent to the cc processor. Essentially, a skimmer but software instead of hardware.
I rarely use a cc at any of the TJ Maxx brand stores anymore because of this being rampant there. And it's obvious, given the 8 declined cards I've had in the past 5 weeks that the problem is big.
I had the same experience trying to use my cc to make a phone call in France. I had to go buy a phone card. I was watching people popping their cc's into the phones with no problem. Not mine. Of course, today I probably couldn't find a pay phone in France!
.

We travel with an unlocked phone and an Italian SIM card, no need for a payphone.
TJMaxx (aka Winners in Canada) is another store with the problem, but I don't usually shop there and if I do, it's strictly chip card only. But it has cut down on the fraud. I still can't see how it's cheaper to pay for the fraud rather than impliment EMV. But the current thinking is that the US banks (which issue cards here) are using Canada as the testing ground to see what works and what the pitfalls are, before they start to impliment in the US. And now that Visa has officially said that they want EMV for smartphone payments, I think it's finally inevitable. http://moneyland.time.com/2011/08/12/visa-puts-its-weight-behind-new-payment-systems/
It's interesting to see how some of the CC companies are handling the setting of PINs in such a way that even the employees can't ever see them. In one case, they sent me a "bingo" card. You choose your PIN from the card and scratch off your pin. When you call to register you pin, you put in the card number and then the four letters under the scratch off area. Even if you give it to the employee there is no way they can know your PIN. That can't set a pin, they can't see a pin. If you lose it, they have to send you a new "bingo" card.

 

[Alibi Ike]

NEVER lease a cc machine
You can buy one for 300. Period. Less on up ebay (and most only take a software upgrade which should be free from your cc processor) to make them PCI compliant but you would have to do your homework. If you are correctly set up as "lodging" and not retail be careful because not all terminals work for lodging
You do not "have to" lease one, it's a choice. Like a car. You can lease it and or buy it but YOU make the choice. Don't blame the cc company for a choice YOU make
Negotiate enough and you may even get a free one.

NEVER lease a cc machine
You can buy one for 300. Period. Less on up ebay (and most only take a software upgrade which should be free from your cc processor) to make them PCI compliant but you would have to do your homework. If you are correctly set up as "lodging" and not retail be careful because not all terminals work for lodging
You do not "have to" lease one, it's a choice. Like a car. You can lease it and or buy it but YOU make the choice. Don't blame the cc company for a choice YOU make
Negotiate enough and you may even get a free one

The only set fee that I pay is $7 a month and that includes the machine. I don't pay anything else, not a per transaction fee, not a gateway fee, nothing. And so far the other companies discount rates are within 1 base point (ie 0.10%) of what I pay. Not a foreign transaction fee.
We just changed all the machines in Canada to accept EMV (Chip & Pin). I would have needed to buy a new machine. It wasn't just a software update online, they changed the physical machine. Same model, very different software. I think they changed the ROM.
While the US is rejecting EMV, Visa just announced that they are going to push it and a few US banks have started to issue EMV cards. Add into that the fact that European banks can now remove tha magnetic stripes means that the US will eventually have no choice. I have American friends who are actually yelling at their bank because they can't get an EMV card. It's so much trouble in Europe without one.
In any case, in Canada, just so you understand, the CC machine works differently now. We have to hit 1 (for sale) and then we have to put in the amount. Only then can we swipe a card. If the card has EMV, I never touch the card. The client puts the card into the handset and follows the instructions on the screen, they then put in a PIN and it authorizes and prints for me a copy that says "Verified by PIN" and a copy for the client. If they don't have EMV, I then swipe the card and process the transaction with a signature. I am protected from fraud for all transactions with EMV. There are no chargebacks. I can't fake it and the client card can't be faked. There is no duplicating the EMV chip. So, I much rather process with EMV.
At restaurants in Canada, the restaurant will generally bring over a handheld unit to your table for you to put your card in and pay. They have a button for the tip % or if you prefer you can put in an amount for the tip. The server never touches your card if you have EMV. And they NEVER disappear with your card anymore.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.

Yes, you can still process without the card. The thing is, the signature is supposed to be checked against the signature on the card. Well, with chip & pin there is no need, you can't get a "fake" signature. The chip & pin also reduce lost, counterfeit and stolen cards. All the counterfeit is magnetic stripe.
.

You can still do transactions like deposits where the card isn't present, correct?
We don't lease our machine but our processor guarantees we will have one by overnight mail if this one goes bad. Yes, I have to pay the shipping, but I don't have to pay for the new machine. We've replaced it once.

Yes, you can still process without the card. The thing is, the signature is supposed to be checked against the signature on the card. Well, with chip & pin there is no need, you can't get a "fake" signature. The chip & pin also reduce lost, counterfeit and stolen cards. All the counterfeit is magnetic stripe.

Here's what cracks me up about the cashier at the store asking to see my credit card after I swipe it myself...there are people who are trained, handwriting experts who hem and haw about whether or not a signature 'matches' and yet, these 16 yo kids can tell if it's 'really' my sig on the slip and not just a clever imitation.
And then there are my friends whose cc was apparently 'recreated' and used to buy tons of electronics at a store far away from where they live. They contested the charges and they were told 'we have a sig on the receipt, you own the charges.' They sent a copy of the back of their card (the sig line) and it wasn't even close to what the processor had on the receipt. 'You faked it. You own the charges.'
The cc company would not back down. They insisted my friends pay this outrageous bill. I do not know how it played out other than after awhile they canceled the card because they wouldn't trust that particular card company again.
.

Here's what cracks me up about the cashier at the store asking to see my credit card after I swipe it myself...there are people who are trained, handwriting experts who hem and haw about whether or not a signature 'matches' and yet, these 16 yo kids can tell if it's 'really' my sig on the slip and not just a clever imitation.
And then there are my friends whose cc was apparently 'recreated' and used to buy tons of electronics at a store far away from where they live. They contested the charges and they were told 'we have a sig on the receipt, you own the charges.' They sent a copy of the back of their card (the sig line) and it wasn't even close to what the processor had on the receipt. 'You faked it. You own the charges.'
The cc company would not back down. They insisted my friends pay this outrageous bill. I do not know how it played out other than after awhile they canceled the card because they wouldn't trust that particular card company again.

Well, no need to check the signature with the PIN. And only mag stripe transactions are basically at risk.
Some businesses are reluctant to change... why? Because they process the CC on the cash registers and they keep the numbers and track your purchases. Well, that's going to end and they can't do it anymore. And gone are the days of the restaurant running off with your card for 15 minutes. Or the guy who puts a skimmer in front of the ATM.
As for having my card cloned... I've had it happen with bother MC and Amex. Amex caught it, called me to tell me and issued a replacement card before I even knew it. As for MC, it has happened twice. One time they suspended the card but didn't call me and I had to call to find out why my transactions weren't working. The other time we know EXACTLY where the number was cloned from... Hannaford Supermarket in the US, owned by Delhaize Group. Their computers were broken into and they had the numbers stored, in spite of the fact that they aren't supposed to. Funny, how many companies have the numbers stored even though they aren't supposed to store them, are supposed to remove them from the database, etc.
To the US it doesn't matter what cards we take, but we very much prefer to pay in CASH now, simply because every time we have had an incident, it has been in the US. To Europe was simply take EMV cards. We have seen Americans trying to use their cards in Europe and it's usually funny/sad because you have to tell them to go see a cashier, that they can't use the automated machine, can't rent a bicycle, can't pay the meter. In many countries, the automated machines use EMV only. There is no mag stripe reader.
.

That Hannaford situtaion wasn't so much that they were storing the info as software had been installed in their data transaction system that was recording every card and every check that was run thru every machine before it was sent to the cc processor. Essentially, a skimmer but software instead of hardware.
I rarely use a cc at any of the TJ Maxx brand stores anymore because of this being rampant there. And it's obvious, given the 8 declined cards I've had in the past 5 weeks that the problem is big.
I had the same experience trying to use my cc to make a phone call in France. I had to go buy a phone card. I was watching people popping their cc's into the phones with no problem. Not mine. Of course, today I probably couldn't find a pay phone in France!
.

We travel with an unlocked phone and an Italian SIM card, no need for a payphone.
TJMaxx (aka Winners in Canada) is another store with the problem, but I don't usually shop there and if I do, it's strictly chip card only. But it has cut down on the fraud. I still can't see how it's cheaper to pay for the fraud rather than impliment EMV. But the current thinking is that the US banks (which issue cards here) are using Canada as the testing ground to see what works and what the pitfalls are, before they start to impliment in the US. And now that Visa has officially said that they want EMV for smartphone payments, I think it's finally inevitable. http://moneyland.time.com/2011/08/12/visa-puts-its-weight-behind-new-payment-systems/
It's interesting to see how some of the CC companies are handling the setting of PINs in such a way that even the employees can't ever see them. In one case, they sent me a "bingo" card. You choose your PIN from the card and scratch off your pin. When you call to register you pin, you put in the card number and then the four letters under the scratch off area. Even if you give it to the employee there is no way they can know your PIN. That can't set a pin, they can't see a pin. If you lose it, they have to send you a new "bingo" card.
.

We travel with an unlocked phone and an Italian SIM card, no need for a payphone.

Someday I'll have a cell phone of some sort. Right now, tho? When I leave the house, no one can contact me. Yippee! (When we travel we have a prepaid phone we take along.)