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Also you could just do it for the big money stays as an extra layer of security and that would save you money..
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this. I guess my thought is...if you still do not understand what an authorization is, even after I've explained that it "holds" your money six days prior to your stay, then that's your problem. After these last two no shows/cancellations, I'm not a happy camper. My thinking is...if you don't have the funds in your account during the penalty phase of the cancellation period, then your intent to show up is not there.
This is the best way for me to do things right now, but I was looking to ensure that the verbage in my confirmation letter to the guest made sense.
.
Banana said:
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this.
How do you know they will? Absence of proof and all that. Being the one Inn that's different catches a guest's attention, and can work in your favor. We are one of the few in our area that charge a deposit, and if you look at our availability calendar, you'll see it doesn't seem to hurt us any...and sometimes that deposit money comes in darn handy in advance. Of course, to each his own...
.
I agree with this perspective...we would never be able to operate without taking a deposit. Being different is not always a bad thing. I think you undervalue yourself by NOT taking a deposit...honestly, if I'm looking at booking and I see that a deposit is required it just makes me realize that I'd better have my plans firmly set before booking.
While I think the authorization approach is logical from your end, I agree that guests just plain do NOT get what this means. I fear it would create more confusion than anything else.
 
Also you could just do it for the big money stays as an extra layer of security and that would save you money..
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this. I guess my thought is...if you still do not understand what an authorization is, even after I've explained that it "holds" your money six days prior to your stay, then that's your problem. After these last two no shows/cancellations, I'm not a happy camper. My thinking is...if you don't have the funds in your account during the penalty phase of the cancellation period, then your intent to show up is not there.
This is the best way for me to do things right now, but I was looking to ensure that the verbage in my confirmation letter to the guest made sense.
.
Banana said:
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this.
How do you know they will? Absence of proof and all that. Being the one Inn that's different catches a guest's attention, and can work in your favor. We are one of the few in our area that charge a deposit, and if you look at our availability calendar, you'll see it doesn't seem to hurt us any...and sometimes that deposit money comes in darn handy in advance. Of course, to each his own...
.
I agree with this perspective...we would never be able to operate without taking a deposit. Being different is not always a bad thing. I think you undervalue yourself by NOT taking a deposit...honestly, if I'm looking at booking and I see that a deposit is required it just makes me realize that I'd better have my plans firmly set before booking.
While I think the authorization approach is logical from your end, I agree that guests just plain do NOT get what this means. I fear it would create more confusion than anything else.
.
I also have an issue with paying the additional fees for the card not being present. I just, for the first time ever in six years, raised my rates this year. I can't raise them again to accommodate additional processing fees. Until the advance authorization does not work, that's the procedure that I'm going to try.
 
Also you could just do it for the big money stays as an extra layer of security and that would save you money..
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this. I guess my thought is...if you still do not understand what an authorization is, even after I've explained that it "holds" your money six days prior to your stay, then that's your problem. After these last two no shows/cancellations, I'm not a happy camper. My thinking is...if you don't have the funds in your account during the penalty phase of the cancellation period, then your intent to show up is not there.
This is the best way for me to do things right now, but I was looking to ensure that the verbage in my confirmation letter to the guest made sense.
.
Banana said:
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this.
How do you know they will? Absence of proof and all that. Being the one Inn that's different catches a guest's attention, and can work in your favor. We are one of the few in our area that charge a deposit, and if you look at our availability calendar, you'll see it doesn't seem to hurt us any...and sometimes that deposit money comes in darn handy in advance. Of course, to each his own...
.
I agree with this perspective...we would never be able to operate without taking a deposit. Being different is not always a bad thing. I think you undervalue yourself by NOT taking a deposit...honestly, if I'm looking at booking and I see that a deposit is required it just makes me realize that I'd better have my plans firmly set before booking.
While I think the authorization approach is logical from your end, I agree that guests just plain do NOT get what this means. I fear it would create more confusion than anything else.
.
I also have an issue with paying the additional fees for the card not being present. I just, for the first time ever in six years, raised my rates this year. I can't raise them again to accommodate additional processing fees. Until the advance authorization does not work, that's the procedure that I'm going to try.
.
I haven't called yet but I found the 'pre auth' key on my terminal. And directions in my handbook for how to do it.
 
Also you could just do it for the big money stays as an extra layer of security and that would save you money..
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this. I guess my thought is...if you still do not understand what an authorization is, even after I've explained that it "holds" your money six days prior to your stay, then that's your problem. After these last two no shows/cancellations, I'm not a happy camper. My thinking is...if you don't have the funds in your account during the penalty phase of the cancellation period, then your intent to show up is not there.
This is the best way for me to do things right now, but I was looking to ensure that the verbage in my confirmation letter to the guest made sense.
.
Banana said:
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this.
How do you know they will? Absence of proof and all that. Being the one Inn that's different catches a guest's attention, and can work in your favor. We are one of the few in our area that charge a deposit, and if you look at our availability calendar, you'll see it doesn't seem to hurt us any...and sometimes that deposit money comes in darn handy in advance. Of course, to each his own...
.
I agree with this perspective...we would never be able to operate without taking a deposit. Being different is not always a bad thing. I think you undervalue yourself by NOT taking a deposit...honestly, if I'm looking at booking and I see that a deposit is required it just makes me realize that I'd better have my plans firmly set before booking.
While I think the authorization approach is logical from your end, I agree that guests just plain do NOT get what this means. I fear it would create more confusion than anything else.
.
I also have an issue with paying the additional fees for the card not being present. I just, for the first time ever in six years, raised my rates this year. I can't raise them again to accommodate additional processing fees. Until the advance authorization does not work, that's the procedure that I'm going to try.
.
I haven't called yet but I found the 'pre auth' key on my terminal. And directions in my handbook for how to do it.
.
What type terminal do you have?
 
Also you could just do it for the big money stays as an extra layer of security and that would save you money..
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this. I guess my thought is...if you still do not understand what an authorization is, even after I've explained that it "holds" your money six days prior to your stay, then that's your problem. After these last two no shows/cancellations, I'm not a happy camper. My thinking is...if you don't have the funds in your account during the penalty phase of the cancellation period, then your intent to show up is not there.
This is the best way for me to do things right now, but I was looking to ensure that the verbage in my confirmation letter to the guest made sense.
.
Banana said:
I'm not fond of the advance deposit, primarily because no other B&B in this area does that. I do not want to lose prospective guests because I charged a night's stay three months in advance. They'll just go to the next B&B that does not do this.
How do you know they will? Absence of proof and all that. Being the one Inn that's different catches a guest's attention, and can work in your favor. We are one of the few in our area that charge a deposit, and if you look at our availability calendar, you'll see it doesn't seem to hurt us any...and sometimes that deposit money comes in darn handy in advance. Of course, to each his own...
.
I agree with this perspective...we would never be able to operate without taking a deposit. Being different is not always a bad thing. I think you undervalue yourself by NOT taking a deposit...honestly, if I'm looking at booking and I see that a deposit is required it just makes me realize that I'd better have my plans firmly set before booking.
While I think the authorization approach is logical from your end, I agree that guests just plain do NOT get what this means. I fear it would create more confusion than anything else.
.
I also have an issue with paying the additional fees for the card not being present. I just, for the first time ever in six years, raised my rates this year. I can't raise them again to accommodate additional processing fees. Until the advance authorization does not work, that's the procedure that I'm going to try.
.
I haven't called yet but I found the 'pre auth' key on my terminal. And directions in my handbook for how to do it.
.
What type terminal do you have?
.
Hypercom.
 
Well, new procedures in place - has worked very well - a little ackward, but that's more me, trying to do it in a smooth, non-confusing manner for the guest. In addition to authorizing the entire stay prior to their arrival, I'm also now offering a cash discount. Four people in the last week have brought me cash, and had no problem whatsoever with the fact that the authorization was already on the card. The only hassle (and it's not a hassle, really - just an extra step) is that if they pay me cash, I have to call the issuing bank and release the authorization. Of the four I've done this for, two required a fax be sent - refused to take it verbally. Fine - again, an extra step..but to ensure I get my money, I'll do it.
I have another four day stay coming up next Friday that booked in March. Like the last one, I've called her twice and emailed with no response. When I attempt to authorize her stay tomorrow, any bets on it going through? When it doesn't, I'll have a full week to rebook it, and not think twice about cancelling her reservation.
 
Since this came up.... TONIGHTS Guests are biking the trail. They gave me two different cards... neither worked... both came back.. "can not use this card for this transaction" Guests can't explain that (me either)...
They have no check book with them, I suggested they go to the ATM and get cash, they state their cc does not allow them to take out cash... They say they will 'mail' me a check when they get home tomorrow... (home is one town away). SO... hmmmm what do I do. I didn't know what to do so I told them it was ok to mail me a check! I know I will probably never see it!
BUT incase its all true... and they really are honest people we still have to treat them well and 'assume' they will pay....
 
Since this came up.... TONIGHTS Guests are biking the trail. They gave me two different cards... neither worked... both came back.. "can not use this card for this transaction" Guests can't explain that (me either)...
They have no check book with them, I suggested they go to the ATM and get cash, they state their cc does not allow them to take out cash... They say they will 'mail' me a check when they get home tomorrow... (home is one town away). SO... hmmmm what do I do. I didn't know what to do so I told them it was ok to mail me a check! I know I will probably never see it!
BUT incase its all true... and they really are honest people we still have to treat them well and 'assume' they will pay.....
I'm new here (not new to innkeeping) and I will keep my thoughts to myself, so as not to offend. But you do know what "assume" means, right?
 
That's a tough one Sunshine, but really what else can you do but hope they send you the check? I had this happen with a military person once, his debit card had been used for an authorization (similar to what Banana is describing) so he not only couldn't use it for my charges but he couldn't take money out at an ATM either. Sorry Banana, the system you're using sounds like way too many steps for you, and too confusing for your guests. I just don't get why you don't take a deposit, is it ONLY because "no one else does"? Be daring, be the first! I think you'll be surprised at how no one even bats an eye.
Many of my guests arrive assuming they prepaid the entire amount of their stay, evidently a lot of B&B's are doing that up front now as well.
 
That's a tough one Sunshine, but really what else can you do but hope they send you the check? I had this happen with a military person once, his debit card had been used for an authorization (similar to what Banana is describing) so he not only couldn't use it for my charges but he couldn't take money out at an ATM either. Sorry Banana, the system you're using sounds like way too many steps for you, and too confusing for your guests. I just don't get why you don't take a deposit, is it ONLY because "no one else does"? Be daring, be the first! I think you'll be surprised at how no one even bats an eye.
Many of my guests arrive assuming they prepaid the entire amount of their stay, evidently a lot of B&B's are doing that up front now as well..
How is it confusing for the guest? I'm authorizing the amount of their stay, and when they arrive, the process is finalized. Those funds are mine, within six days of their stay - they know this when booking because I verbalize it, they agree to it when they fill out the reservation request.
I also do not want to pay the processing fee for not having the card present. I also prefer cash (don't we all?). If I've already charged the first night's stay, I'm not getting cash.
This military person you are referring to surely knew that the authorization had been placed on his card. You give your credit card number to someone, you expect certain things. Same with Sunshine's guests. Someone comes to my door and their card doesn't work (because I didn't authorize it?), they are not staying here.
 
Since this came up.... TONIGHTS Guests are biking the trail. They gave me two different cards... neither worked... both came back.. "can not use this card for this transaction" Guests can't explain that (me either)...
They have no check book with them, I suggested they go to the ATM and get cash, they state their cc does not allow them to take out cash... They say they will 'mail' me a check when they get home tomorrow... (home is one town away). SO... hmmmm what do I do. I didn't know what to do so I told them it was ok to mail me a check! I know I will probably never see it!
BUT incase its all true... and they really are honest people we still have to treat them well and 'assume' they will pay.....
Well good luck. I hope they really are trustworthy people but when 2 cards don't work and can't use an ATM...The red flag goes up. Sorry...no room at this inn :-(
 
That's a tough one Sunshine, but really what else can you do but hope they send you the check? I had this happen with a military person once, his debit card had been used for an authorization (similar to what Banana is describing) so he not only couldn't use it for my charges but he couldn't take money out at an ATM either. Sorry Banana, the system you're using sounds like way too many steps for you, and too confusing for your guests. I just don't get why you don't take a deposit, is it ONLY because "no one else does"? Be daring, be the first! I think you'll be surprised at how no one even bats an eye.
Many of my guests arrive assuming they prepaid the entire amount of their stay, evidently a lot of B&B's are doing that up front now as well..
How is it confusing for the guest? I'm authorizing the amount of their stay, and when they arrive, the process is finalized. Those funds are mine, within six days of their stay - they know this when booking because I verbalize it, they agree to it when they fill out the reservation request.
I also do not want to pay the processing fee for not having the card present. I also prefer cash (don't we all?). If I've already charged the first night's stay, I'm not getting cash.
This military person you are referring to surely knew that the authorization had been placed on his card. You give your credit card number to someone, you expect certain things. Same with Sunshine's guests. Someone comes to my door and their card doesn't work (because I didn't authorize it?), they are not staying here.
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The military person had no clue what the authorization was all about, I stood here and watched him call the cc company. I believe it was a debit card, and he was new to using it, so had never had anything happen like that before.
I'm just playing devil's advocate for you, please don't be upset or think that I'm judging you...you have to put a process in place that works for you. But since you are changing something anyway I'm just giving you a different perspective. For me personally the whole "authorization" thing sounds like a lot of jargon, and as a guest it would be confusing TO ME (mainly because I've never had to deal with that anywhere else, when I use my card that charge gets put on, and it's done). BUT, here we do more than 90% online bookings so I wouldn't be able to verbalize the process to the guest like you are.
FWIW, we've been able to negotiate with our cc processor that our rate for the card not being present is very close to the rate for the swipe. And we do a very high volume, so for us taking the deposit is a must. Also, the 50% deposit ensures year-round cash flow.
My other concern is you cannot guarantee how long the credit card will take to release the funds after you release the authorization (as you said, you're now having to fax the company in some instances to get the authorization released)...it might not be a big deal but it just sounds like it would take so much time. So the guest thinks the funds are available because they've been released, but then it takes an extra day or so because you have to fax some other documentation. It's not your fault but the guest might perceive it that way.
 
If they live one town away have them get on the phone and call someone they know or a rel and get them to bring the $ right over. It is not your concern how they get the $ but they need to pay for their stay, RIGHT NOW. Meanwhile this IS a couple where you need their license # and a copy of their ID.
 
Sunshine - there is a number on the back of the card...If the guest finds it strange that neither card worked, they should have been willing to call to find out the problem. Sometimes the card company will give an overide approval (if over their limit). Keep the card numbers if you can so you can run the cards again if they do not send the check ASAP (or given that they live in the next town they could drive over). As was posted in another tread, running out on a lodging bill is a felony in some states. It is wise to know the laws governing and protecting your business. You should be able to find that law online under your states civil codes.
Banana - In ways I like what you are offering but I still think guests, in general, do not thoroughly understand the authorization process and the time it 'holds' their money. Even after you have authorized the release, it will take in some cases 3-5 days to release those funds in their account. This is all for the bank's benefit, so the longer they stretch it out, the better for them. BUT guests will not understand that it is the BANK (CC co.) they will blame you.
 
If a take a deposit of one night's stay, how do I credit that back, if they cancel outside of the seven day policy without having been charged for it? Meaning, someone books for next month, I charge one night, they cancel in two days, so I credit those funds back. Who pays me for the charges I just incurred?
Also, the authorization is only being released if they come here with cash. So, for the majority of guests, this will never be an issue.
I am open to other ways of doing this - I appreciate everyone's input. But I like the way it is working so far - it is giving me piece of mind, the guests have not had a problem with it, and the process is becoming more organized and smooth every time I do it. It's one extra step, whether they pay with cash (calling their bank) or by completing the card transaction. I just am not seeing consequences from this. When I do, I'll consider doing something else.
 
If a take a deposit of one night's stay, how do I credit that back, if they cancel outside of the seven day policy without having been charged for it? Meaning, someone books for next month, I charge one night, they cancel in two days, so I credit those funds back. Who pays me for the charges I just incurred?
Also, the authorization is only being released if they come here with cash. So, for the majority of guests, this will never be an issue.
I am open to other ways of doing this - I appreciate everyone's input. But I like the way it is working so far - it is giving me piece of mind, the guests have not had a problem with it, and the process is becoming more organized and smooth every time I do it. It's one extra step, whether they pay with cash (calling their bank) or by completing the card transaction. I just am not seeing consequences from this. When I do, I'll consider doing something else..
Banana said:
If a take a deposit of one night's stay, how do I credit that back, if they cancel outside of the seven day policy without having been charged for it? Meaning, someone books for next month, I charge one night, they cancel in two days, so I credit those funds back. Who pays me for the charges I just incurred?
Also, the authorization is only being released if they come here with cash. So, for the majority of guests, this will never be an issue.
I am open to other ways of doing this - I appreciate everyone's input. But I like the way it is working so far - it is giving me piece of mind, the guests have not had a problem with it, and the process is becoming more organized and smooth every time I do it. It's one extra step, whether they pay with cash (calling their bank) or by completing the card transaction. I just am not seeing consequences from this. When I do, I'll consider doing something else.
If they cancel we charge a processing fee ($25 in our case, some folks do $10 or $15), so we are never out the cc fee if they cancel.
Just be careful with the whole "Absence of proof is not proof of absence" thing, just because no one is saying they've had a problem doesn't mean they aren't, or that you aren't losing bookings because of it.
If your system works and you have time to handle all those authorizations then you should keep doing it that way. It just sounded cumbersome for you.
 
If a take a deposit of one night's stay, how do I credit that back, if they cancel outside of the seven day policy without having been charged for it? Meaning, someone books for next month, I charge one night, they cancel in two days, so I credit those funds back. Who pays me for the charges I just incurred?
Also, the authorization is only being released if they come here with cash. So, for the majority of guests, this will never be an issue.
I am open to other ways of doing this - I appreciate everyone's input. But I like the way it is working so far - it is giving me piece of mind, the guests have not had a problem with it, and the process is becoming more organized and smooth every time I do it. It's one extra step, whether they pay with cash (calling their bank) or by completing the card transaction. I just am not seeing consequences from this. When I do, I'll consider doing something else..
From what I understand, and I may be wrong, you do not get charged for returning money to guests. So, you would pay the processing fee for taking the money, but not for giving it back. If the pre-auth doesn't work out down the road, you could charge a cancellation fee to cover the processing charges. Without the card in hand, figure it's going to be 4% to process the card and then come up with a fee that covers that. Say a general, one night deposit would cost you $8 without the card, then charge $15-$20 for a cancellation.
But, I totally get wanting to know the money is secure. Especially as we have had problems with cards that are no good on a no show. We figured out that in a year's time we still lose more money by pre-processing the cards than by the no-shows with bad cards. So, like you, we'll do what we do until it doesn't work.
Do you call the processor for all of those pre-auths or do you do it thru the machine? I'd be interested to know if you find other charges on your monthly statement from the processor since you started this program. I have no faith that they tell the truth the first time out.
 
If a take a deposit of one night's stay, how do I credit that back, if they cancel outside of the seven day policy without having been charged for it? Meaning, someone books for next month, I charge one night, they cancel in two days, so I credit those funds back. Who pays me for the charges I just incurred?
Also, the authorization is only being released if they come here with cash. So, for the majority of guests, this will never be an issue.
I am open to other ways of doing this - I appreciate everyone's input. But I like the way it is working so far - it is giving me piece of mind, the guests have not had a problem with it, and the process is becoming more organized and smooth every time I do it. It's one extra step, whether they pay with cash (calling their bank) or by completing the card transaction. I just am not seeing consequences from this. When I do, I'll consider doing something else..
From what I understand, and I may be wrong, you do not get charged for returning money to guests. So, you would pay the processing fee for taking the money, but not for giving it back. If the pre-auth doesn't work out down the road, you could charge a cancellation fee to cover the processing charges. Without the card in hand, figure it's going to be 4% to process the card and then come up with a fee that covers that. Say a general, one night deposit would cost you $8 without the card, then charge $15-$20 for a cancellation.
But, I totally get wanting to know the money is secure. Especially as we have had problems with cards that are no good on a no show. We figured out that in a year's time we still lose more money by pre-processing the cards than by the no-shows with bad cards. So, like you, we'll do what we do until it doesn't work.
Do you call the processor for all of those pre-auths or do you do it thru the machine? I'd be interested to know if you find other charges on your monthly statement from the processor since you started this program. I have no faith that they tell the truth the first time out.
.
I do the authorization on the machine. Processor told me it would be 75 cents to voice it, 20 cents to do on machine. Yes, I'm pretty anxious to get my first statement with these on it to confirm what they told me.
 
I don't know about it being confusing as in the UK all hotels at least swipe a card on arrival and pre-authorise so people are getting used to it. I know we would perfer cash but I myself am more inclined to money in the bank than blowing in the wind! A lot of places round where I am if people book online they are charging the card right away as some online companies charge when you book so for the ones that don't they pass on the card details to the B&B and they decide whether to charge or not which leads to a lot of customers thinking they have paid when they havn't. I had a lady ring me in a panic becuase the thought she had booked with us (we don't charge in advance) as all the money had gone out of her account (she wasn't comming for 3 months) it wasn't us but it was one of our neighbours (completely different name woman was a bit of an idiot) and they charge every online booking when it comes in irrespective of when they are comming. Thought that was a bit harsh but I figure if it is in their policies then it is their business.
 
I don't know about it being confusing as in the UK all hotels at least swipe a card on arrival and pre-authorise so people are getting used to it. I know we would perfer cash but I myself am more inclined to money in the bank than blowing in the wind! A lot of places round where I am if people book online they are charging the card right away as some online companies charge when you book so for the ones that don't they pass on the card details to the B&B and they decide whether to charge or not which leads to a lot of customers thinking they have paid when they havn't. I had a lady ring me in a panic becuase the thought she had booked with us (we don't charge in advance) as all the money had gone out of her account (she wasn't comming for 3 months) it wasn't us but it was one of our neighbours (completely different name woman was a bit of an idiot) and they charge every online booking when it comes in irrespective of when they are comming. Thought that was a bit harsh but I figure if it is in their policies then it is their business..
Camberley, you bring up the most important facts. It is the guest responsibility to know and understand the policies of where they book. We are all not the same, and neither are our policies. To assume we are the same is a big risk on their part. (As the saying goes about the word assume.)
I have even noticed that some of the large booking directories have placed reminders in this regard on their websites. But in todays world of the "MeMeMeMeMe", it can't be their neglect it is always blame on someone else.
 
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