Diagnosing a PITA

[Copperhead]

Morticia - "It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive."And from another Morticia posting
"Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's."
Yes, we as innkeepers are not immune to having the posibility of someone going 'postal' on our property. We need to have that discussion and know exactly what we would do in that type of situation.
I had never given it a thought about an guest coming into my home with a weapon, then one time I was cleaning a room and was returning some missplaced hangers in a closet and there on the shelf was a gun. Freaked me out to no end and I went right to DH to discuss it. The guest was really as friendly of a person any of us would want as a guest in our home, but my issue was more as to why he felt he needed a gun in my home...did he not feel safe? Well that afternoon after seeing that I had cleaned the room (he was not aware we did that service), he came down to appoligize about the gun. He stated he forgot he had it in his vehicle when they left home and he felt it was safer here than left in his vehicle while parked in the big city. He told me it was totally empty etc... This sort of put us at ease but I still felt better when they were gone.

 

[JBloggs]

Some guests are armed and some innkeepers are armed. As mentioned on another thread about a s x offender and you and your family living there, we always need to be on the look out for odd behavior, anything that raises a red flag. We ARE the judge and jury when it comes to the safety of our families and our guests.

 

[Morticia]

Morticia - "It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive."And from another Morticia posting
"Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's."
Yes, we as innkeepers are not immune to having the posibility of someone going 'postal' on our property. We need to have that discussion and know exactly what we would do in that type of situation.
I had never given it a thought about an guest coming into my home with a weapon, then one time I was cleaning a room and was returning some missplaced hangers in a closet and there on the shelf was a gun. Freaked me out to no end and I went right to DH to discuss it. The guest was really as friendly of a person any of us would want as a guest in our home, but my issue was more as to why he felt he needed a gun in my home...did he not feel safe? Well that afternoon after seeing that I had cleaned the room (he was not aware we did that service), he came down to appoligize about the gun. He stated he forgot he had it in his vehicle when they left home and he felt it was safer here than left in his vehicle while parked in the big city. He told me it was totally empty etc... This sort of put us at ease but I still felt better when they were gone..

We talked about the situation encountered this weekend. Then we were interrupted by the doorbell ringing and off I blithely went...

 

[Innkeeper To Go]

Hate to say it, but I will...you enabled him by the tiptoeing and the extra goodies and ignoring his trespassing (smoking). He cowed all of you not just his wife. She will never leave him because she doesn't see anyone stand up to him. You tried but you backed down. Like catlady said- no ifs, ands or buts- 'Get your things and leave or we call the police to remove you.'.

You are correct in your assessment, Morticia. We're in AZ which has new laws allowing concealed carry weapons even without the training and permit. Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative. My grown kids, one of whom is a clinical counselor, concurred. My husband was too flabberghasted to have an opinion! We also live out in the country with only two sherrifs covering a huge area and have been told they could not come, even with an intruder at the door! (Hence, everyone carries their own protection.)
In hindsight, I wish I had assessed their condition at arrival, on the front porch, with the door locked behind me, and sent them on their way right there. But of course, I was expecting them to be normal and somewhat recovered from stress after an afteroon in town and out to dinner. Who wouldn't be, except for perhaps a sociopath? I do think this incident was quite instructive for me, to tune in more carefully to the clues. There was a guy a few months ago who yelled then hung up me when they could not book a last minute massage and I called back and told them not to come and to never try to book a room here again. I guess I gave this guy too much mercy due to the traffic problems.
But yes, Morticia, as usual, what you have to say is spot on and may we all learn. Thank you for speaking up.
.

Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative.

Were there other guests?
Sorry but when you are afraid and intimidated, that's when you excuse yourself and call the sheriff to have them escorted away.
You have a responsibility to other guests. If you are afraid of someone, don't let them onto your property. And if they're already there, quietly get yourself away from the guest and call the sheriff.
.

It would be impossible to share everything about the entire situation, but considering all factors, I think the end result bore out that we made the right moves. Certainly had he been overtly threatening, we would have called for intervention. My original point of course, was that dealing with the personality - disordered (especially borderline or narcissistic) can be extremely taxing! And should be avoided, if it can be helped.
.

Totally agree with avoiding these types when possible. Some of the smoothest talkers, tho, are the worst snakes when it comes right down to it. Obviously your guy was not a smooth talker! And there is no way to know if you had turned them away on the road if he wouldn't have shown up anyway.
It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive.
Edited to add- I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.
.

I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.

My feelings exactly. I'm not here to diagnose guests and don't want my family members diagnosing them either.
If they're not suitable, next.
But if an innkeeper really and truly thinks any guest might be dangerous, then shame on her for exposing other guests to any risk of harm. Not okay.
IMHO.
.

I can concur, up to a point. Me? I live in town with a fulltime police force. However, I have lived in the 'hinterlands' where police protection/coverage/assistance is sketchy. It's not that they don't want to help, it's that they're covering territory the size of RI with 2 officers.
There is no way they can guarantee someone will be there to help you. In most cases, they don't even investigate anything short of felonies.
Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's.
Then again, maybe a show of force from the innkeepers would have made him slink away like the bully he is. Again unknown. Maybe she saved the wife's life by not forcing the issue. Unknown.
.

I'm not advocating for a show of force by the innkeeper. Quite the contrary. I'm advocating for the innkeeper to calmly and politely remove herself from his presence long enough to call the sheriff.
I'm advocating for that because she said she was intimidated and afraid. She also said she thought he might have a gun and that's why she was afraid to confront him because of that.
That's some pretty serious stuff.
And what I'm saying is that if you're an innkeeper and you feel that way about a guest, you have a responsibility to peacefully remove him. Call the police. If it takes them 30 minutes, offer him tea.
But seriously get him out of there.
Confront him? No. Wait for the police. And have them escort him out.

 

[JBloggs]

We all have our own signals that go off and can only really react to a situation if we ourselves are in it. It is so hard to FEEL how she felt at that given time. I appreciate her sharing with us.

 

[gillumhouse]

Hate to say it, but I will...you enabled him by the tiptoeing and the extra goodies and ignoring his trespassing (smoking). He cowed all of you not just his wife. She will never leave him because she doesn't see anyone stand up to him. You tried but you backed down. Like catlady said- no ifs, ands or buts- 'Get your things and leave or we call the police to remove you.'.

You are correct in your assessment, Morticia. We're in AZ which has new laws allowing concealed carry weapons even without the training and permit. Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative. My grown kids, one of whom is a clinical counselor, concurred. My husband was too flabberghasted to have an opinion! We also live out in the country with only two sherrifs covering a huge area and have been told they could not come, even with an intruder at the door! (Hence, everyone carries their own protection.)
In hindsight, I wish I had assessed their condition at arrival, on the front porch, with the door locked behind me, and sent them on their way right there. But of course, I was expecting them to be normal and somewhat recovered from stress after an afteroon in town and out to dinner. Who wouldn't be, except for perhaps a sociopath? I do think this incident was quite instructive for me, to tune in more carefully to the clues. There was a guy a few months ago who yelled then hung up me when they could not book a last minute massage and I called back and told them not to come and to never try to book a room here again. I guess I gave this guy too much mercy due to the traffic problems.
But yes, Morticia, as usual, what you have to say is spot on and may we all learn. Thank you for speaking up.
.

Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative.

Were there other guests?
Sorry but when you are afraid and intimidated, that's when you excuse yourself and call the sheriff to have them escorted away.
You have a responsibility to other guests. If you are afraid of someone, don't let them onto your property. And if they're already there, quietly get yourself away from the guest and call the sheriff.
.

It would be impossible to share everything about the entire situation, but considering all factors, I think the end result bore out that we made the right moves. Certainly had he been overtly threatening, we would have called for intervention. My original point of course, was that dealing with the personality - disordered (especially borderline or narcissistic) can be extremely taxing! And should be avoided, if it can be helped.
.

Totally agree with avoiding these types when possible. Some of the smoothest talkers, tho, are the worst snakes when it comes right down to it. Obviously your guy was not a smooth talker! And there is no way to know if you had turned them away on the road if he wouldn't have shown up anyway.
It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive.
Edited to add- I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.
.

I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.

My feelings exactly. I'm not here to diagnose guests and don't want my family members diagnosing them either.
If they're not suitable, next.
But if an innkeeper really and truly thinks any guest might be dangerous, then shame on her for exposing other guests to any risk of harm. Not okay.
IMHO.
.

I can concur, up to a point. Me? I live in town with a fulltime police force. However, I have lived in the 'hinterlands' where police protection/coverage/assistance is sketchy. It's not that they don't want to help, it's that they're covering territory the size of RI with 2 officers.
There is no way they can guarantee someone will be there to help you. In most cases, they don't even investigate anything short of felonies.
Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's.
Then again, maybe a show of force from the innkeepers would have made him slink away like the bully he is. Again unknown. Maybe she saved the wife's life by not forcing the issue. Unknown.
.

I'm not advocating for a show of force by the innkeeper. Quite the contrary. I'm advocating for the innkeeper to calmly and politely remove herself from his presence long enough to call the sheriff.
I'm advocating for that because she said she was intimidated and afraid. She also said she thought he might have a gun and that's why she was afraid to confront him because of that.
That's some pretty serious stuff.
And what I'm saying is that if you're an innkeeper and you feel that way about a guest, you have a responsibility to peacefully remove him. Call the police. If it takes them 30 minutes, offer him tea.
But seriously get him out of there.
Confront him? No. Wait for the police. And have them escort him out.
.

Sorry to say this, but had she called the sheriff, by the time they could or would arrive? he removed himself faster. I grew up in the country and as small as our county was, the wait for a county mountie was horrible. You would be dead and buried if it was a serious situation before they would get there. Sorry folks, having lived in the boonies and knowing how things really are (and this is NOT a slap at the sheriff dept - they are over-worked and undermanned) defusing the situation as much as possible was the way to go. Pollyanna handled it properly. I doubt other guests were at risk. The bully had honed in on his targets - his wife and Pollyanna - and they were appropriately weak. Not every bully collapses when challenged.

 

[Innkeeper To Go]

Hate to say it, but I will...you enabled him by the tiptoeing and the extra goodies and ignoring his trespassing (smoking). He cowed all of you not just his wife. She will never leave him because she doesn't see anyone stand up to him. You tried but you backed down. Like catlady said- no ifs, ands or buts- 'Get your things and leave or we call the police to remove you.'.

You are correct in your assessment, Morticia. We're in AZ which has new laws allowing concealed carry weapons even without the training and permit. Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative. My grown kids, one of whom is a clinical counselor, concurred. My husband was too flabberghasted to have an opinion! We also live out in the country with only two sherrifs covering a huge area and have been told they could not come, even with an intruder at the door! (Hence, everyone carries their own protection.)
In hindsight, I wish I had assessed their condition at arrival, on the front porch, with the door locked behind me, and sent them on their way right there. But of course, I was expecting them to be normal and somewhat recovered from stress after an afteroon in town and out to dinner. Who wouldn't be, except for perhaps a sociopath? I do think this incident was quite instructive for me, to tune in more carefully to the clues. There was a guy a few months ago who yelled then hung up me when they could not book a last minute massage and I called back and told them not to come and to never try to book a room here again. I guess I gave this guy too much mercy due to the traffic problems.
But yes, Morticia, as usual, what you have to say is spot on and may we all learn. Thank you for speaking up.
.

Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative.

Were there other guests?
Sorry but when you are afraid and intimidated, that's when you excuse yourself and call the sheriff to have them escorted away.
You have a responsibility to other guests. If you are afraid of someone, don't let them onto your property. And if they're already there, quietly get yourself away from the guest and call the sheriff.
.

It would be impossible to share everything about the entire situation, but considering all factors, I think the end result bore out that we made the right moves. Certainly had he been overtly threatening, we would have called for intervention. My original point of course, was that dealing with the personality - disordered (especially borderline or narcissistic) can be extremely taxing! And should be avoided, if it can be helped.
.

Totally agree with avoiding these types when possible. Some of the smoothest talkers, tho, are the worst snakes when it comes right down to it. Obviously your guy was not a smooth talker! And there is no way to know if you had turned them away on the road if he wouldn't have shown up anyway.
It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive.
Edited to add- I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.
.

I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.

My feelings exactly. I'm not here to diagnose guests and don't want my family members diagnosing them either.
If they're not suitable, next.
But if an innkeeper really and truly thinks any guest might be dangerous, then shame on her for exposing other guests to any risk of harm. Not okay.
IMHO.
.

I can concur, up to a point. Me? I live in town with a fulltime police force. However, I have lived in the 'hinterlands' where police protection/coverage/assistance is sketchy. It's not that they don't want to help, it's that they're covering territory the size of RI with 2 officers.
There is no way they can guarantee someone will be there to help you. In most cases, they don't even investigate anything short of felonies.
Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's.
Then again, maybe a show of force from the innkeepers would have made him slink away like the bully he is. Again unknown. Maybe she saved the wife's life by not forcing the issue. Unknown.
.

I'm not advocating for a show of force by the innkeeper. Quite the contrary. I'm advocating for the innkeeper to calmly and politely remove herself from his presence long enough to call the sheriff.
I'm advocating for that because she said she was intimidated and afraid. She also said she thought he might have a gun and that's why she was afraid to confront him because of that.
That's some pretty serious stuff.
And what I'm saying is that if you're an innkeeper and you feel that way about a guest, you have a responsibility to peacefully remove him. Call the police. If it takes them 30 minutes, offer him tea.
But seriously get him out of there.
Confront him? No. Wait for the police. And have them escort him out.
.

Sorry to say this, but had she called the sheriff, by the time they could or would arrive? he removed himself faster. I grew up in the country and as small as our county was, the wait for a county mountie was horrible. You would be dead and buried if it was a serious situation before they would get there. Sorry folks, having lived in the boonies and knowing how things really are (and this is NOT a slap at the sheriff dept - they are over-worked and undermanned) defusing the situation as much as possible was the way to go. Pollyanna handled it properly. I doubt other guests were at risk. The bully had honed in on his targets - his wife and Pollyanna - and they were appropriately weak. Not every bully collapses when challenged.
.

Hey, I'm not saying they were at risk. She said she was afraid and thought he had a weapon and that heightened her fear.
Do I think there's exaggeration going on here? Yes. Do I think anyone was at risk? Not likely. Do I think anything happened at all? Hmmm.
But had the situation actually happened and an innkeeper really felt her life was in danger, I'd sure hope she would call the sheriff if she's in the boonies (as I am) or the police if she's in a city. That rather than a personality diagnosis would be the responsible thing.

 

[gillumhouse]

Hate to say it, but I will...you enabled him by the tiptoeing and the extra goodies and ignoring his trespassing (smoking). He cowed all of you not just his wife. She will never leave him because she doesn't see anyone stand up to him. You tried but you backed down. Like catlady said- no ifs, ands or buts- 'Get your things and leave or we call the police to remove you.'.

You are correct in your assessment, Morticia. We're in AZ which has new laws allowing concealed carry weapons even without the training and permit. Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative. My grown kids, one of whom is a clinical counselor, concurred. My husband was too flabberghasted to have an opinion! We also live out in the country with only two sherrifs covering a huge area and have been told they could not come, even with an intruder at the door! (Hence, everyone carries their own protection.)
In hindsight, I wish I had assessed their condition at arrival, on the front porch, with the door locked behind me, and sent them on their way right there. But of course, I was expecting them to be normal and somewhat recovered from stress after an afteroon in town and out to dinner. Who wouldn't be, except for perhaps a sociopath? I do think this incident was quite instructive for me, to tune in more carefully to the clues. There was a guy a few months ago who yelled then hung up me when they could not book a last minute massage and I called back and told them not to come and to never try to book a room here again. I guess I gave this guy too much mercy due to the traffic problems.
But yes, Morticia, as usual, what you have to say is spot on and may we all learn. Thank you for speaking up.
.

Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative.

Were there other guests?
Sorry but when you are afraid and intimidated, that's when you excuse yourself and call the sheriff to have them escorted away.
You have a responsibility to other guests. If you are afraid of someone, don't let them onto your property. And if they're already there, quietly get yourself away from the guest and call the sheriff.
.

It would be impossible to share everything about the entire situation, but considering all factors, I think the end result bore out that we made the right moves. Certainly had he been overtly threatening, we would have called for intervention. My original point of course, was that dealing with the personality - disordered (especially borderline or narcissistic) can be extremely taxing! And should be avoided, if it can be helped.
.

Totally agree with avoiding these types when possible. Some of the smoothest talkers, tho, are the worst snakes when it comes right down to it. Obviously your guy was not a smooth talker! And there is no way to know if you had turned them away on the road if he wouldn't have shown up anyway.
It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive.
Edited to add- I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.
.

I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.

My feelings exactly. I'm not here to diagnose guests and don't want my family members diagnosing them either.
If they're not suitable, next.
But if an innkeeper really and truly thinks any guest might be dangerous, then shame on her for exposing other guests to any risk of harm. Not okay.
IMHO.
.

I can concur, up to a point. Me? I live in town with a fulltime police force. However, I have lived in the 'hinterlands' where police protection/coverage/assistance is sketchy. It's not that they don't want to help, it's that they're covering territory the size of RI with 2 officers.
There is no way they can guarantee someone will be there to help you. In most cases, they don't even investigate anything short of felonies.
Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's.
Then again, maybe a show of force from the innkeepers would have made him slink away like the bully he is. Again unknown. Maybe she saved the wife's life by not forcing the issue. Unknown.
.

I'm not advocating for a show of force by the innkeeper. Quite the contrary. I'm advocating for the innkeeper to calmly and politely remove herself from his presence long enough to call the sheriff.
I'm advocating for that because she said she was intimidated and afraid. She also said she thought he might have a gun and that's why she was afraid to confront him because of that.
That's some pretty serious stuff.
And what I'm saying is that if you're an innkeeper and you feel that way about a guest, you have a responsibility to peacefully remove him. Call the police. If it takes them 30 minutes, offer him tea.
But seriously get him out of there.
Confront him? No. Wait for the police. And have them escort him out.
.

Sorry to say this, but had she called the sheriff, by the time they could or would arrive? he removed himself faster. I grew up in the country and as small as our county was, the wait for a county mountie was horrible. You would be dead and buried if it was a serious situation before they would get there. Sorry folks, having lived in the boonies and knowing how things really are (and this is NOT a slap at the sheriff dept - they are over-worked and undermanned) defusing the situation as much as possible was the way to go. Pollyanna handled it properly. I doubt other guests were at risk. The bully had honed in on his targets - his wife and Pollyanna - and they were appropriately weak. Not every bully collapses when challenged.
.

Hey, I'm not saying they were at risk. She said she was afraid and thought he had a weapon and that heightened her fear.
Do I think there's exaggeration going on here? Yes. Do I think anyone was at risk? Not likely. Do I think anything happened at all? Hmmm.
But had the situation actually happened and an innkeeper really felt her life was in danger, I'd sure hope she would call the sheriff if she's in the boonies (as I am) or the police if she's in a city. That rather than a personality diagnosis would be the responsible thing.
.

That rather than a personality diagnosis would be the responsible thing.
In this we totally agree. I am lucky to figure out why I do stuff.

 

[Pollyanna]

Hate to say it, but I will...you enabled him by the tiptoeing and the extra goodies and ignoring his trespassing (smoking). He cowed all of you not just his wife. She will never leave him because she doesn't see anyone stand up to him. You tried but you backed down. Like catlady said- no ifs, ands or buts- 'Get your things and leave or we call the police to remove you.'.

You are correct in your assessment, Morticia. We're in AZ which has new laws allowing concealed carry weapons even without the training and permit. Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative. My grown kids, one of whom is a clinical counselor, concurred. My husband was too flabberghasted to have an opinion! We also live out in the country with only two sherrifs covering a huge area and have been told they could not come, even with an intruder at the door! (Hence, everyone carries their own protection.)
In hindsight, I wish I had assessed their condition at arrival, on the front porch, with the door locked behind me, and sent them on their way right there. But of course, I was expecting them to be normal and somewhat recovered from stress after an afteroon in town and out to dinner. Who wouldn't be, except for perhaps a sociopath? I do think this incident was quite instructive for me, to tune in more carefully to the clues. There was a guy a few months ago who yelled then hung up me when they could not book a last minute massage and I called back and told them not to come and to never try to book a room here again. I guess I gave this guy too much mercy due to the traffic problems.
But yes, Morticia, as usual, what you have to say is spot on and may we all learn. Thank you for speaking up.
.

Since moving here from CA, we've discovered guns are very pervasive here, and these folks were AZ residents. The man had such a pent-up fury about him, that, frankly, I was afraid and intimidated. When you have someone whose behavior is unpredictable, it may be more prudent to do nothing provocative.

Were there other guests?
Sorry but when you are afraid and intimidated, that's when you excuse yourself and call the sheriff to have them escorted away.
You have a responsibility to other guests. If you are afraid of someone, don't let them onto your property. And if they're already there, quietly get yourself away from the guest and call the sheriff.
.

It would be impossible to share everything about the entire situation, but considering all factors, I think the end result bore out that we made the right moves. Certainly had he been overtly threatening, we would have called for intervention. My original point of course, was that dealing with the personality - disordered (especially borderline or narcissistic) can be extremely taxing! And should be avoided, if it can be helped.
.

Totally agree with avoiding these types when possible. Some of the smoothest talkers, tho, are the worst snakes when it comes right down to it. Obviously your guy was not a smooth talker! And there is no way to know if you had turned them away on the road if he wouldn't have shown up anyway.
It never occurs to me to assume a guest will be armed. Kind of hope I can continue to be that naive.
Edited to add- I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.
.

I guess I wouldn't go thru the diagnosis on someone like this, someone I would never want to come back again. We'd both heave a sigh of relief, talk about it with friends over drinks and be done with it. I don't really care what kind of personality type someone is. They are, to us, one of 2 types: Nice people and not nice people. There's a certain shade of 'people we put up with' as well. But they are few and far between.
I don't take these people as 'challenges'. They can go elsewhere and be someone else's 'project'.

My feelings exactly. I'm not here to diagnose guests and don't want my family members diagnosing them either.
If they're not suitable, next.
But if an innkeeper really and truly thinks any guest might be dangerous, then shame on her for exposing other guests to any risk of harm. Not okay.
IMHO.
.

I can concur, up to a point. Me? I live in town with a fulltime police force. However, I have lived in the 'hinterlands' where police protection/coverage/assistance is sketchy. It's not that they don't want to help, it's that they're covering territory the size of RI with 2 officers.
There is no way they can guarantee someone will be there to help you. In most cases, they don't even investigate anything short of felonies.
Altho, I think the innkeeper went too far in attempting to appease this jerk, I have to take her word on the advisability of 'getting into it' with someone who sounds unhinged, with no one to back her up, except family, if it went horribly wrong.
No, I'm not happy about the situation, wish none of us ever have to encounter this behavior, but it's obvious it happens and we all need to understand what our 'Plan B' is, which I think they've spent a lot of time going over this weekend.
It's given all of us something to think about. Would there have been serious harm to the other guests, the innkeepers, their family, etc had they forcibly tried to remove him? Unknown. No one wants to live in fear in their own home which is why this incident should be part of the conversation at all of our B&B's.
Then again, maybe a show of force from the innkeepers would have made him slink away like the bully he is. Again unknown. Maybe she saved the wife's life by not forcing the issue. Unknown.
.

I'm not advocating for a show of force by the innkeeper. Quite the contrary. I'm advocating for the innkeeper to calmly and politely remove herself from his presence long enough to call the sheriff.
I'm advocating for that because she said she was intimidated and afraid. She also said she thought he might have a gun and that's why she was afraid to confront him because of that.
That's some pretty serious stuff.
And what I'm saying is that if you're an innkeeper and you feel that way about a guest, you have a responsibility to peacefully remove him. Call the police. If it takes them 30 minutes, offer him tea.
But seriously get him out of there.
Confront him? No. Wait for the police. And have them escort him out.
.

Sorry to say this, but had she called the sheriff, by the time they could or would arrive? he removed himself faster. I grew up in the country and as small as our county was, the wait for a county mountie was horrible. You would be dead and buried if it was a serious situation before they would get there. Sorry folks, having lived in the boonies and knowing how things really are (and this is NOT a slap at the sheriff dept - they are over-worked and undermanned) defusing the situation as much as possible was the way to go. Pollyanna handled it properly. I doubt other guests were at risk. The bully had honed in on his targets - his wife and Pollyanna - and they were appropriately weak. Not every bully collapses when challenged.
.

Hey, I'm not saying they were at risk. She said she was afraid and thought he had a weapon and that heightened her fear.
Do I think there's exaggeration going on here? Yes. Do I think anyone was at risk? Not likely. Do I think anything happened at all? Hmmm.
But had the situation actually happened and an innkeeper really felt her life was in danger, I'd sure hope she would call the sheriff if she's in the boonies (as I am) or the police if she's in a city. That rather than a personality diagnosis would be the responsible thing.
.

That rather than a personality diagnosis would be the responsible thing.
In this we totally agree. I am lucky to figure out why I do stuff.
.

Just a note about "diagnosis." We've been very long term foster parents and also have more than our fair share of mental health issues within both of our own families and the families of those we've interacted with as foster and adoptive parents. Because of this, we've had to learn a lot about mental health issues. A suspected diagnosis gives one a handle on what kind of behavior to expect and how to respond most productively. It's not a label of condemnation, it's an avenue to gain insight, understanding and a positive outcome in relating. I've found it very useful in helping me communicate with those with various mental illnesses or disorders, both known and professionally diagnosed or simply suspected due to a pattern of behavior. Anyone working with a variety of the public can benefit from understanding more about mental health or the lack of it.

 

[Joey Camb]

We are very lucky where I am as we are only a 5 min drive from the police station and as we are only about 1/2 a mile from the pubs and clubs on a weekend they patrole them so are even closer. We don't have guns in this country (I am not getting into a debate either way about this) but people can have knives and all sorts so from a safety point of view it makes little difference. We are lucky that we have had very few really weird people but I always say there are other members of staff here (even when not) and so on. We all have to take sensible precautions when and where we can.

 

[JBloggs]

We don't have guns in this country[/h3]That is the biggest joke, YOU CERTAINLY DO have guns in your country. Just because they are banned except for pellet guns. Heck I was in London and shots rang out and we even saw the shell casings outside our hotel in the square. You crack me up, sorry but head in the sand applies to this one.
Okay I bit.

 

[Joey Camb]

We don't have guns in this country[/h3]That is the biggest joke, YOU CERTAINLY DO have guns in your country. Just because they are banned except for pellet guns. Heck I was in London and shots rang out and we even saw the shell casings outside our hotel in the square. You crack me up, sorry but head in the sand applies to this one.
Okay I bit..

I didn't mean not at all but it is illegal to carry a conceiled weapon of any kind so if I even suspected a guest had a gun or any other weapon I could simply ring and the police would take them away. There are guns out there and there is no way to get rid of them all but at least it is not something I have to worry about on a daily basis. Knives however are as common as pigeons and can be bought anywhere so I worry about that more.

 

[Joey Camb]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

 

[Penelope]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.

 

[Pollyanna]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.

 

[Morticia]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.

One's man's bread is another man's PITA? That sort of thing? (All puns intended.)
And, no, it's not something to joke about, but it does explain why some of us go ballistic while others shake their heads and wonder how was that different from what happens everyday? (This from the original winner of the PITA award a couple of years back.)

 

[Pollyanna]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.
.

UPDATE
Discovered today that Mr. Mad immediately went home, signed up on TripAdvisor, apparently read the review guidelines carefully, and left a politely scathing deceitful 2 star review in great detail. For most of it, I was thinking "What? Huh? That never happened... that's not true...." My first less than 5 star review out of 40.
I contacted TA to say that he did threaten to leave a bad review and to please consider removing it, but good luck to me on that. Made a reasoned reply too without calling him a psycho-stalker! And I guess that takes a while to show up.
Also left me a stupid email message and that address is now blocked.
Yikes, must get my head in gear now for my current pleasant guests and two new arrivals. Time to bake some chocolate chip cookies and eat a few too! We usually have a lovely time here with many thankful guests and I think I just need to move on and enjoy that now.

 

[Morticia]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.
.

UPDATE
Discovered today that Mr. Mad immediately went home, signed up on TripAdvisor, apparently read the review guidelines carefully, and left a politely scathing deceitful 2 star review in great detail. For most of it, I was thinking "What? Huh? That never happened... that's not true...." My first less than 5 star review out of 40.
I contacted TA to say that he did threaten to leave a bad review and to please consider removing it, but good luck to me on that. Made a reasoned reply too without calling him a psycho-stalker! And I guess that takes a while to show up.
Also left me a stupid email message and that address is now blocked.
Yikes, must get my head in gear now for my current pleasant guests and two new arrivals. Time to bake some chocolate chip cookies and eat a few too! We usually have a lovely time here with many thankful guests and I think I just need to move on and enjoy that now.
.

Kind of figured that would happen. Chocolate chip cookies cure a world of problems, tho!
I hope you were able to get enough info into your reply to set the scene for the next reader of the reviews.
'We were very distressed to hear of the tragic accident the guest had had to handle while on the road to us. We hope he is able to get the help he needs in dealing with the enormity of his distress. We strive to create a relaxed and welcoming environment here for all of our guests, but when tragedy strikes, the warmth and welcome may not be enough for that particular guest. Although we truly sympathize, it was unfortunate he chose to take his anger and frustration out on the innkeeper at our B&B.'

 

[Pollyanna]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.
.

UPDATE
Discovered today that Mr. Mad immediately went home, signed up on TripAdvisor, apparently read the review guidelines carefully, and left a politely scathing deceitful 2 star review in great detail. For most of it, I was thinking "What? Huh? That never happened... that's not true...." My first less than 5 star review out of 40.
I contacted TA to say that he did threaten to leave a bad review and to please consider removing it, but good luck to me on that. Made a reasoned reply too without calling him a psycho-stalker! And I guess that takes a while to show up.
Also left me a stupid email message and that address is now blocked.
Yikes, must get my head in gear now for my current pleasant guests and two new arrivals. Time to bake some chocolate chip cookies and eat a few too! We usually have a lovely time here with many thankful guests and I think I just need to move on and enjoy that now.
.

Took TripAdvisor just one hour to let me know that the review would remain. Sigh.....

 

[Joey Camb]

It is one of my only problems with internet bookings you have no clue who a person is till the arrive on the door step at least if they ring you can try and get a feel for them in advance. Not that that always works we had 6 men come and they all booked separately to get round my settings of not being able to book more than two twin rooms at once (I do this to keep out stag and Hen parties which are nothing but trouble) But one of them rang and seemed nice and when he came was nice and well behaved however 2 of the chaps they brought with them were a nightmare from start to finish. They played loud music in their room which I had to go and tell them off for (I was on my own that night and could have used some back up) they were a bit drunk and then used rude language telling me what they were setting out to do in town. (not language you would use infront of a woman) and I felt very intimidated. Sometime during the night they must have crashed about broke a lamp and smashed the doors of the wardrobe to bits. My mum checked them in and being very nieve took cash When it is men like this I always take a card so I can charge for damage. So I had to charge the group organisers card. I sent him an email saying he should be careful of people he called his friends if they left him stuck with the bill for his damages. I felt threatened in this situation and there was no weapons involved. I think it depends on the situation. It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous.

It doesn't take a weapon to be dangerous

And there it is in a nutshell. I've been reading this thread carefully. I think it depends on one's own level of safety. What my friend could handle without breaking a sweat, might put me in a rubber room. Everyone is different...everyone's level is a little different.
.

Good point. Due to some personal history, extreme anger, hostility, yelling, attacking, accusing etc, make me feel very intimidated and threatened, whereas others may just blow it off as the person behaving this way is just a jerk and so what.
.

UPDATE
Discovered today that Mr. Mad immediately went home, signed up on TripAdvisor, apparently read the review guidelines carefully, and left a politely scathing deceitful 2 star review in great detail. For most of it, I was thinking "What? Huh? That never happened... that's not true...." My first less than 5 star review out of 40.
I contacted TA to say that he did threaten to leave a bad review and to please consider removing it, but good luck to me on that. Made a reasoned reply too without calling him a psycho-stalker! And I guess that takes a while to show up.
Also left me a stupid email message and that address is now blocked.
Yikes, must get my head in gear now for my current pleasant guests and two new arrivals. Time to bake some chocolate chip cookies and eat a few too! We usually have a lovely time here with many thankful guests and I think I just need to move on and enjoy that now.
.

Took TripAdvisor just one hour to let me know that the review would remain. Sigh.....
.

I am sorry honey but you just have to be your normal fab self and you will get lots of amazing reviews and it will push his right into the Trash Can where it deserves to be.