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David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
 
We have both B&B and a vacation rental apartment (new this summer). We've only listed the apartment on the A ir site. So far, it is performing as expected. Checking the properities and rates listed for our area, there are many kinds of accommodations at many price levels, including hotels and B&Bs. We are at about the middle of price/location/amenity. I think it will work for us.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
I agree that it is an unfair playing field. I also agree that many of the regulations and laws that B&B's must abide by are important for guest safety. For all B&B owners, if it is something that really upsets you, I would recommend getting together with your local lodging community and put together a formal petition to local authorities. Outline exactly what properties (addresses) are listed, what they're doing that you think is illegal (what laws/ordinances they're breaking), why it's dangerous, why it's unfair, why it's stealing money from taxpayers, etc. etc. You could probably even get some larger hotels in your community on board, as it's competition for them as well. Get signatures from as many business owners/managers as possible. Then take it to the authorities and let them know that all you want them to do is contact Airbnb to have those listings removed. This takes most of the work out of it for the authorities, which is what you really need to do to have a chance of them taking it seriously.
The problem is that it's a local law issue, not federal, and I think many people will find their town/community authorities just have bigger things to worry about. Which is why I don't think Airbnb will be going anywhere, and why although you disagree with some of the competition they're facilitating, they are still a great opportunity to market your property and reach a new userbase.
.
Hi David,
I agree that local authorities might be able to do something. I even thought that local jurisdictions could maybe pass laws that say taxes must be collected at the same time as the rent, thus making AirBnB liable for collecting them. Having said that, I still don't see them as viable competition as some said on here when they aren't even zoned to be in the business in the first place!
As for being able to report specific listings, it is next to impossible, since their site is totaly opaque, revealing no names, addresses, websites, or phone numbers until after a guest pays for the place. Also, every time I check out their listings in my area, more have popped up!
Bill
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
 
I would think that if you pay a local hospitality tax, you could call the people you pay and point it out.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
I understand. We have the same problem, except here it's five different taxes. Two of which they may be exempt from, but the three others... they aren't. And they give us all a bad name.
One of these days a government department with subpoena the records from AirBnB and everyone will run and their business model will be done for.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
I understand. We have the same problem, except here it's five different taxes. Two of which they may be exempt from, but the three others... they aren't. And they give us all a bad name.
One of these days a government department with subpoena the records from AirBnB and everyone will run and their business model will be done for.
.
My goodness, I hope so! I read once there are 5000 local jurisdictions...I could be way off. You'd think that at least one of them would act. I am not sure how that would bust their business, but it would sure be a step in the right direction.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
I understand. We have the same problem, except here it's five different taxes. Two of which they may be exempt from, but the three others... they aren't. And they give us all a bad name.
One of these days a government department with subpoena the records from AirBnB and everyone will run and their business model will be done for.
.
My goodness, I hope so! I read once there are 5000 local jurisdictions...I could be way off. You'd think that at least one of them would act. I am not sure how that would bust their business, but it would sure be a step in the right direction.
.
From a legal standpoint, all the people have to declare that income on their federal income tax form. Do you really think that they are?
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
bill1243 said:
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
But it is not just this site that allows them to advertise there are many, many more. And it is not just your city with this problem either. The big city near me has this problem as well and even the hospitality assoc. can not get the city put a stop to it all... besides the fact that they blow the whistle and stop a handful and another dozen start.
Near me it is the vacation rentals.... a full house renting for what I charge for a room. I have tried to bring this to the attention of our local zoning/tax offices - nothing happens!
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
I understand. We have the same problem, except here it's five different taxes. Two of which they may be exempt from, but the three others... they aren't. And they give us all a bad name.
One of these days a government department with subpoena the records from AirBnB and everyone will run and their business model will be done for.
.
My goodness, I hope so! I read once there are 5000 local jurisdictions...I could be way off. You'd think that at least one of them would act. I am not sure how that would bust their business, but it would sure be a step in the right direction.
.
From a legal standpoint, all the people have to declare that income on their federal income tax form. Do you really think that they are?
.
Eric, of course not every one is. But I have no evidence that they are not reporting it and I don't want to waste the time of government. Also, I am not vengeful. Also, in my main job I am an accountant, and would consider this a breach of ethics.
But again, it does not matter...since I brought out the fact that the real problem is that there are now over 150 rooms being offering in my city. Killing off one does no good.
Folks, we need to find a way, to stop them all. The person that mentioned that a city or county should put the heat on the site itself might be onto something. Someone else told me that there is an association of cities or counties that might be able to do something. I thought that was a great idea.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
bill1243 said:
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
But it is not just this site that allows them to advertise there are many, many more. And it is not just your city with this problem either. The big city near me has this problem as well and even the hospitality assoc. can not get the city put a stop to it all... besides the fact that they blow the whistle and stop a handful and another dozen start.
Near me it is the vacation rentals.... a full house renting for what I charge for a room. I have tried to bring this to the attention of our local zoning/tax offices - nothing happens!
.
Hi Copperhead,
Yes you are right, but AirBnb is the big daddy. There are also IStopover, Roomorama, and there's a new one in Europe that plans on coming here...it is called Wimdu, and they just raised $90 million!!
And yes, again you are right....it is NOT just my city. It is MOST cities. The zoning code we have here in Portland is pretty similar to that of all other cities and counties. It defines residential housing as being for one month or more. In my city there is a variance to be a B&B, but none of these people follow it. As for whole places, we do not have any variance or permit or anything that allows them to do less than a month renting. That too is probably similar to most big cities.
I have never really had a problem with vacation whole houses. They cater to bigger groups and aren't really my market. But for 150 fake BnB's to show up, and at half the price and NOT being legal to operate, then I do have a problem with that!
 
I wanted to ask a question on this similar topic. What about Homeaway from TA? They are courting us daily to get us listed on there, in the mail, emails and phone calls. And yet...is this not the same thing as the airBnB idea?
I ask this today as our guests who checked out stayed in a Homeaway house rental while in Charlottesville this week.
 
I wanted to ask a question on this similar topic. What about Homeaway from TA? They are courting us daily to get us listed on there, in the mail, emails and phone calls. And yet...is this not the same thing as the airBnB idea?
I ask this today as our guests who checked out stayed in a Homeaway house rental while in Charlottesville this week..
Joey Bloggs said:
I wanted to ask a question on this similar topic. What about Homeaway from TA? They are courting us daily to get us listed on there, in the mail, emails and phone calls. And yet...is this not the same thing as the airBnB idea?
I ask this today as our guests who checked out stayed in a Homeaway house rental while in Charlottesville this week.
Homeaway is essentially the same as AirBnB.
 
Homeaway is owned by bedandbreakfast.com. Tripadvisor owns Flipkey.
 
David, I think you are right, but I can't help thinking about Jay Karen's statement about being able to operate on a level playing field.
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
But to see all these interlopers come in, operating totally illegally, charging half the price and using a name like ___BnB, it just seems like unfair competition..
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
.
copperhead said:
bill1243 said:
As for the subject of competition, I have long thought that there were two tiers of B&B's, with one being the high-end ones, and another being lesser establishments with shared bathrooms, providing the food but with the guests making their own breakfast, continental style, and maybe with non-primo locations.
Only 2 tiers? So a B&B either is worthy of Sel ect Re gis try or falls into the other mold?
Sorry there are far more that fall in the middle of the road, IMMHO!
I agree. Not even close!
Price point my dear watson, price point.
This chap needs to go take some innkeeping classes, missed it by a mile!
.
Hi Joey, I guess what I meant was even if there are several price points, I seem to find two styles of B&B's in my area.
And then AirBnb shows up, offering mostly non-legal listings and at relatively low price points. I don't mind competition, but only if on a level playing field. There is one down the street from me, in a very beautiful house and renting out for $55 a night.! No breakfast, but they do have their own bathroom. And of course there are no transient taxes being collected! How is that not almost direct competition, offering almost the same features at much less cost, and all the while on a property without a variance to be operating as such?
.
Well, you can always make 15% to 30% of what he is making.... the IRS is paying whistleblowers.
.
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
.
bill1243 said:
Hi Eric,
When it comes to income tax, I of course would have no idea if he is paying that or not. All I really know is that he is not-zoned right and is not collecting transient taxes.
And overall, in my city, there are something upwards of 150 rooms for rent on AirBnb alone, probably most all illegal. Not to mention the 50 vacation houses on there too. Dealing with one of them is like battling windmills!
Also, like I said elsewhere, the site is purposely opaque, so I have no idea who the people are except for this one person down the street. And also, every time I go on the site there are more and more listings. They claim they are adding 1000 listings a day to their site.
You don't have to prove anything, just name them individuals and what income you think they are hiding. The IRS does the rest of it and if you were right, sends you a cheque for 15 to 30% of the money they collect.
.
Hi eric,
I don't want to report someone for something I have no idea about. That happened to me once, and I would never do that to someone else unless I was sure.
And as I said, killing off one fish when the pond is full of them is not worth it. I'm trying to find a way to get them all killed off. But I am striking out on it. Not only is the site opaque, but my zoning department of my city doesn't act on it. They are only complaint driven and I need to know any and all addresses and names for them to do anything.
It's crazy because the city tax department wants the money, but the zoning department says it's illegal for them to be renting at all, but doesn't do much about it. It's quire frustrating!!
.
I understand. We have the same problem, except here it's five different taxes. Two of which they may be exempt from, but the three others... they aren't. And they give us all a bad name.
One of these days a government department with subpoena the records from AirBnB and everyone will run and their business model will be done for.
.
In your own opinion, why is that the taxes are not the same? I also have the same problem with you guys. Do you think that subpoena will answer our problems?
 
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