Speaking of Innsanity

[Samster]

You all are confirming what I am saying, the innsanity of it all, and wonder why people burn out. 100+ days with no days off? That is just plain ludicrous. The toll it takes on YOU is not worth it. Attitude, health and spirit.
I am just saying these things out loud again as innkeepers boast they can do what they want when they want how they want, and I will say for the most part that is rubbish. Like mentioned, any family owned business is 110%. We also live IN the business on top of the entire burden or owning and operating the business, there is no separation from it, ever. I want to cut the glam and be honest, when I do I always get the same old same old. Obv we want bookings, that is the business we are in.
Disclaimer: If you have very low occupancy, and have days off moreso than days on, the above comment DNA.
As originally stated, innsanity to not take days off, everyone needs time off. As American's the stats show we work and take less days off and holidays than any other country and add to that being an innkeeper and it is ridiculous. No paid vacation, no sick days...you pour every cent back into the building..

You are NOT wrong. We DO need time to ourselves. I also found out this week I prefer 3-night reservations to 5-night. Maybe it was because of what is going on with DH right now, but doing different breakfasts each morning became a stretch (although I do have lots of them I can do, it was just a chore) - saved my best breakfast for Sunday when i had a full-house. Because things were gong so well with the guests (had 2 breakfast times), poor DH called on the intercom (it is on the phone so I pretended it was an outside call) at 11 to ask if he could have some breakfast. He got his oatmeal about 11:30.
.

It's totally different when you are one person taking care of a guest room or two vs. a full house of 14 guests.

 

[white pine]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

This is what our friend used to do--I thought it was great. This was a big lesson for me--you have a CHOICE. She would put up the NO VACANCY and close the gate. (Often kept it closed, not locked). Another lesson learned is that if you act like a doormat you will get walked on; I think this contributes to burn out too. Taking time as it came allowed her to do it for 45+ years.
Question is with bookings coming from online, do you mark yourself full to avoid last minute bookings or calls? Also, on another topic does anyone you have DNB ever call when they still see openings? What do you say?

 

[Samster]

You all are confirming what I am saying, the innsanity of it all, and wonder why people burn out. 100+ days with no days off? That is just plain ludicrous. The toll it takes on YOU is not worth it. Attitude, health and spirit.
I am just saying these things out loud again as innkeepers boast they can do what they want when they want how they want, and I will say for the most part that is rubbish. Like mentioned, any family owned business is 110%. We also live IN the business on top of the entire burden or owning and operating the business, there is no separation from it, ever. I want to cut the glam and be honest, when I do I always get the same old same old. Obv we want bookings, that is the business we are in.
Disclaimer: If you have very low occupancy, and have days off moreso than days on, the above comment DNA.
As originally stated, innsanity to not take days off, everyone needs time off. As American's the stats show we work and take less days off and holidays than any other country and add to that being an innkeeper and it is ridiculous. No paid vacation, no sick days...you pour every cent back into the building..

Joey Bloggs, I applaud you for your honesty and telling it like it is! We closed after 2 years after doubling our business in the second year from a start-up. We had a fantastic last month in business in what should have been a very slow month here. The attitude that I got from a few people on this forum astounded me, "Oh, you couldn't handle it" or "Gee, I'm so sorry that you closed". Business was not BAD! It has been the BEST decision. (And I say that with a very large mortgage on a second house hanging over our heads!!!)
I decided that I didn't want to live like that with my 65 year old husband working full-time in another job and then trying to help on the weekends and doing maintenance, etc. It was asking too much of him and I was working too hard with very little sleep. Even though I had part-time help and some help with the yards, by the time all the expenses were paid, we were just breaking even. The trend would have been to make more money in our third year but I would have had to deal with additional help and all that goes with that. And, we still wouldn't have been able to spend time with each other, our family, and friends.
We are hard workers, but my dh has been working since he got out of high school and he'll have to work another couple of years to re-coup investment losses so that he can finally, maybe sort of retire.
This is a business where you have to make time for yourselves or your relationships suffer......... Just my 2 cents....

 

[Joey Camb]

I think that if you work non stop all the time you will be fit for nothing and your business will suffer and your customers won't like a crabby innkeeper. It is dead where we are in August so we would be staying open for maybe 4 guests in a week we make more money but recuporating and redecorating.

 

[muirford]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.

 

[JBloggs]

Happy 20th!

 

[Samster]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Good for you for taking time off on your 20th Anniversary! I mean, we shouldn't even have to justify something like that, should we?

 

[muirford]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

so... does that mean..no more time off for you..work your butt off till you do burn out and then hope to sell???? That does not make sense to me. Taking some time off should not be punishment when selling your B & B :-(
.

No, we won't do that, but I bet a lot of people do. We may suffer for it financially a bit, but I don't want to leave the business only after I'm completely burned out and it's a distress sale. But some brokers and B&B consultants don't really see things that way - hence you have the drive for 100% occupancy, ever-expanding amenities which suck up your time and energy and dollars, and selling your soul to get more guests!

 

[Morticia]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.

 

[muirford]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Good for you for taking time off on your 20th Anniversary! I mean, we shouldn't even have to justify something like that, should we?
.

No, we shouldn't. We were actually going to take more days and have an innsitter, until I remembered that I am on jury duty next month and have to call in every Monday night. So we can't plan anything that isn't cancellable at the last minute, nor anything too far away. We plan to take advantage of some friends (non-innmates) this time.

 

[muirford]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.
.

Yes, I know. I would kill for one of your brokers right now (and you know which one I mean).

 

[Morticia]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

This is what our friend used to do--I thought it was great. This was a big lesson for me--you have a CHOICE. She would put up the NO VACANCY and close the gate. (Often kept it closed, not locked). Another lesson learned is that if you act like a doormat you will get walked on; I think this contributes to burn out too. Taking time as it came allowed her to do it for 45+ years.
Question is with bookings coming from online, do you mark yourself full to avoid last minute bookings or calls? Also, on another topic does anyone you have DNB ever call when they still see openings? What do you say?
.

Also, on another topic does anyone you have DNB ever call when they still see openings? What do you say?
Post this as a different thread, if you would, as I think you'll see a lot of differetn responses to it!
As for online booking when it's my day off- if we have decided that this day is 'ours,' we block off the calendar online.

 

[JBloggs]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.

 

[Samster]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

so... does that mean..no more time off for you..work your butt off till you do burn out and then hope to sell???? That does not make sense to me. Taking some time off should not be punishment when selling your B & B :-(
.

No, we won't do that, but I bet a lot of people do. We may suffer for it financially a bit, but I don't want to leave the business only after I'm completely burned out and it's a distress sale. But some brokers and B&B consultants don't really see things that way - hence you have the drive for 100% occupancy, ever-expanding amenities which suck up your time and energy and dollars, and selling your soul to get more guests!

.

Muirford, I think folks learn more from these honest revelations about the business vs. painting a rosy picture. I appreciated your discussion of what was involved in finding housekeeping help! There have been other innkeepers here that haven't been able to find help for their entire busy season and nearly killed themselves doing it all themselves. Because most innkeepers strive for perfection and are such hard workers, we have to save ourselves from "inn-sanity"! haha.......

 

[Morticia]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.

We went to the town hall to find out taxes, etc. We wanted to know what the town had the property appraised at.
Otherwise, in re expenses, we were told it all depends on how you operate the business what your expenses will be. We could choose a much more elaborate or a much simpler breakfast, but here's what they spent (but not 'here's what they made for breakfast.')
I would have to go look at the spreadsheets to see what sort of info we did have given to us. Utilites may have been included. But I do know that the expenses that were considered 'optional' as I mentioned were excluded. The reason given was we may decide to not buy new sheets, towels, etc, so it was irrelevant what they PO's paid for those things. Or we might decide to completely renovate everything, again making what the PO's paid for things they bought irrelevant.

 

[Samster]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.

We went to the town hall to find out taxes, etc. We wanted to know what the town had the property appraised at.
Otherwise, in re expenses, we were told it all depends on how you operate the business what your expenses will be. We could choose a much more elaborate or a much simpler breakfast, but here's what they spent (but not 'here's what they made for breakfast.')
I would have to go look at the spreadsheets to see what sort of info we did have given to us. Utilites may have been included. But I do know that the expenses that were considered 'optional' as I mentioned were excluded. The reason given was we may decide to not buy new sheets, towels, etc, so it was irrelevant what they PO's paid for those things. Or we might decide to completely renovate everything, again making what the PO's paid for things they bought irrelevant.
.

We walked away from turnkey deals like that. That's ridiculous. It's like saying that when you buy a restaurant, everything could be different based on the menu and so forth. Business sales come with business information or "buyer beware". A couple of places that didn't have the business details, got offers based on real estate only. They were still for sale years later. Gee, I wonder why?

 

[gillumhouse]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Congrats on your impending 20th. May you have a lovely anniversary and many. many more.
We celebrated our 35th yesterday. I went to the Air Force Band Concert but he stayed home because he still has huge problems from this last surgery. Such is life among the ancients.

 

[Morticia]

If you are thinking of selling your inn as a business, closing rather than having an innsitter can hurt your revenue numbers. One of the inns we looked at before we bought ours closed for Monday and Tuesday every week - the owners went to a cabin. It did sell eventually but as a private residence. We've had the same problem - closing for two weeks about a month before potential buyers looked at our numbers hurt our revenue picture, even though the overall annual revenue was best ever..

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer. We heard that sort of thing in a lot of places, 'Well, the sellers choose to close for such and such, and that's a place you can improve the business.' (Not saying your biz needs improving as you said yourself it was a fantastic season.)
When we bought here, the owners never closed. We found out later, from guests, that they would hire innsitters but they never told us that. What they told us was, 'you can't close and lose money.' Obviously, we don't take that to heart and we close for a variety of reasons.
If a day is handed to me in season, I'll take it. But I don't opt to close in season. We find you lose 'traction' when you that. Weird but true.
.

A broker should be able to explain those numbers properly to a buyer.

Unfortunately that was not our experience with the buyers' broker. We also had the issue that things we choose to hire out (laundry, housekeeping, etc.) because DH has in the last two years had the opportunity to do software work. We decided he should take an ongoing project which he was uniquely qualified for so that we could start building an alternative income as we transition out of innkeeping. Different owners (and us for the first six years) could do those things themselves and keep the income. This is not the way all brokers work, but it is the way that this one works. Unfortunately, he is very active in our region and we suspect that is hurting our selling position now.
We may still close for a day or so when it makes sense, like on our 20th anniversary next month. But for extended periods we will use innsitters. That really should have been disclosed to you, and it will be to any of our prospective buyers.
.

Interesting how different the experiences with brokers has been. Our broker told us it was none of our business how the innkeepers spent the money they made. ie- housekeeping, sending the laundry out, landscapers, etc. Basically, what we were told was- here's the money they made, you figure out if you can make it work with what your expenses will be. (And us not even knowing what the expenses might be! How much does a housekeeper make, for example? Lawn mowing? Snow plowing? All of it was an unknown.)
The only thing they told us about was how much they spent on food. Everything else was 'optional'- housekeeping, maintenance, laundry, all of it.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.
.

As an inn that is for sale, from experience I can say: The first thing people want to know when they inquire are the operating expenses. They also want costs for taxes, utilities, etc.
Oddly enough not a one has asked us how much a breakfast costs, not one.

We went to the town hall to find out taxes, etc. We wanted to know what the town had the property appraised at.
Otherwise, in re expenses, we were told it all depends on how you operate the business what your expenses will be. We could choose a much more elaborate or a much simpler breakfast, but here's what they spent (but not 'here's what they made for breakfast.')
I would have to go look at the spreadsheets to see what sort of info we did have given to us. Utilites may have been included. But I do know that the expenses that were considered 'optional' as I mentioned were excluded. The reason given was we may decide to not buy new sheets, towels, etc, so it was irrelevant what they PO's paid for those things. Or we might decide to completely renovate everything, again making what the PO's paid for things they bought irrelevant.
.

We walked away from turnkey deals like that. That's ridiculous. It's like saying that when you buy a restaurant, everything could be different based on the menu and so forth. Business sales come with business information or "buyer beware". A couple of places that didn't have the business details, got offers based on real estate only. They were still for sale years later. Gee, I wonder why?
.

Everything around here was like that. One place sent us 10, single-spaced sheets of paper that they said was their 'checkbook register' and we could sort it all out ourselves if we wanted to know what the expenses were. Interestingly enough, the expenses far outweighed the income. We passed on that place.
It makes it hard to compare apples to apples if a person is looking in a variety of regions if the regional differences in how properties are presented is so different.

 

[Morticia]

Any given job you have a days off or weekend off EVERY week,
I meant to reply to this earlier...people who work corporate jobs have done this to themselves. How many not-retired guests do you have who require WiFi? A good cell signal? Why? No one needs to check emails on vacation if they are simply personal emails. But almost every 'corporate' worker who comes thru the door insists they HAVE to stay in touch with what is going on at the office while they are on vacation.
They have to have a cell signal so they can 'put out fires' while they are on vacation.
I'd love to tell them it doesn't matter a hill of beans. If your corporation is going to lay you off, it doesn't matter if you are wired internally to the company's server, they're going to let you go. Happened to us, has happened to several of our corporate guests. Corporate guests who brought laptops to stay in the loop were fired while they were on the job in another state. One friend was fired while he was guarding the subway stations in NYC while in the National Guard. Right in my own home Gomez was called while at a funeral to fix a problem and he was subsequently fired even after such a show of corporate-mindedness as to not tell the caller to go to hell.
Take your time off, don't buy into the corporate buzz, work is not everything, work pays the bills it does not make you a better person, a more loving father, mother, sibling, child.

 

[gillumhouse]

Any given job you have a days off or weekend off EVERY week,
I meant to reply to this earlier...people who work corporate jobs have done this to themselves. How many not-retired guests do you have who require WiFi? A good cell signal? Why? No one needs to check emails on vacation if they are simply personal emails. But almost every 'corporate' worker who comes thru the door insists they HAVE to stay in touch with what is going on at the office while they are on vacation.
They have to have a cell signal so they can 'put out fires' while they are on vacation.
I'd love to tell them it doesn't matter a hill of beans. If your corporation is going to lay you off, it doesn't matter if you are wired internally to the company's server, they're going to let you go. Happened to us, has happened to several of our corporate guests. Corporate guests who brought laptops to stay in the loop were fired while they were on the job in another state. One friend was fired while he was guarding the subway stations in NYC while in the National Guard. Right in my own home Gomez was called while at a funeral to fix a problem and he was subsequently fired even after such a show of corporate-mindedness as to not tell the caller to go to hell.
Take your time off, don't buy into the corporate buzz, work is not everything, work pays the bills it does not make you a better person, a more loving father, mother, sibling, child..

I had a temp job for about 17 months in an HR dept. She worked way too much. I used to tell her the truth that SHE, especially in her position, should have known - the compnay will use you up and toss you aside when they are done with you no matter how hard you worked.
It is what corporations do. They take whatever is willing to be given, whether thinking it is the way to keep the job or get promoted, and once they can find someone else to do it cheaper - you are gone. They will also keep on the hall-walkers because it is cheaper to pay them to do nothing than it is to track every employee in a department for a year to prove they were not singled out. Been in the corporate world and thank goodness am too old so do not have to worry about ever going back. They want me less than I want them.