BedandBreakfast.com takes on Select Registry?!?

[wendydk]

Copperhead,
I realize you don’t feel served by this latest BB.com service and this is understandable, but perhaps you could find perspectives where it may indeed serve you: to the extent the “diamond” properties help carry BB.com’s operating requirements, there’s less weight for the “mom and pop B&Bs” to carry. Obviously, BB.com needs inflows to support the services it provides. I think “innsiderinfo” is reaching when saying BB.com is “…focused on higher end and larger places”. Despite all the ranting about BB.com, BB.com has X thousand B&Bs advertising with them and I would be shocked if the majority of those advertisers didn’t have eight rooms or less.
BB.com has to go where the roomnights are and BB.com cannot afford to lose the four to eight room properties. Within the B&B industry, BB.com is segmenting and trying to serve the segments differently. I would assert that they should be doing this. I think B&Bs would have reason to complain if the diamond properties were not being charged appropriately, but BB.com is charging a rate the “mom and pops” would not accept.
There simply aren’t that many large B&Bs. In Colorado there are 300+ B&B and far fewer than 20 percent could be called “larger”. Perhaps BB.com can report to us what their property profile is.
I do think you raise an important issue: what should the bed and breakfast industry put forward as requirements to be called a B&B? Clearly, we are harmed by other lodging properties targeting our B&B clientele and muddying the water as to what is what.
I would offer these requirements:
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]A strong consensus of reasonable persons would at a glance from exterior vantage points and in the absence of signage identify the establishment as a family home. Anything that is obviously not a home should not be a bed and breakfast.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]The establishment does not have a restaurant open to the public and does not offer room service.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]The establishment offers at no extra charge a breakfast to its guests that a reasonable person would call a full breakfast.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]Guests at the establishment reserve named, specific rooms, not “room types”.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]The establishment has “B&B” or “Bed and Breakfast” in the name and on its signage.
I offer these thoughts on B&B requirements:
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]I don’t think one can put forward “having staff” as a disqualification. Too many B&Bs have part-time staff to handle peak occupancy.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]I think the number of rooms is a difficult criterion unless you set it really high (say, fifteen rooms). We have ten rooms and the place feels like a B&B to our clientele. We get little or no feedback that we haven’t delivered on the “bed and breakfast” in our name.
·[FONT= &quot] [/FONT]The “B&B” in the name requirement is an important element of integrity. Everybody wants to poach the B&B guests by offering "breakfast", but not everybody wants the negative associations that come with B&B in the name. Moreover, guests are more likely to complain about a property that declares itself a B&B and does not deliver what people expect from a B&B.
P.S.For the record we are a larger property, have the big marketing budget, and have no interest in the expensive“diamond” offering..

I would go even further for my true b&b criteria:
Not only is it a family home but the owners should be the innkeepers and live in the faciity, not just on the grounds.
Staff should be strictly behind the scenes (housekeeping/maintenance) and guests should expect to interact primarily with the owners at checkin/checkout and breakfast.
Based on these criteria I doubt many of what I consider to be "true" b&b's would meet the Diamond Collection criteria. And I maintain that B&B.com has always been most keenly focused on promoting larger properties, if only because they had a very early effort to make the entire niche seem more professional. They will always go "where the roomnights are". And looking at their offerings, particularly my recent experience with Rezovations, they are gearing more and more towards actual boutique hotels and larger inns.
.

I would go even further for my true b&b criteria:
Not only is it a family home but the owners should be the innkeepers and live in the faciity, not just on the grounds.
Staff should be strictly behind the scenes (housekeeping/maintenance) and guests should expect to interact primarily with the owners at checkin/checkout and breakfast.

Well put Innsider...that's exactly what I look for when I travel and is the basis for my thinking it is HIGHLY important that the innkeepers put a photo and blurb about themselves on their website. If I don't see that, I don't book. I am staying at these people's HOMES, for crying out loud!
If John is counting, I agree with the suggestion that the new Diamond program have it's own website and URL, with a link from bb.com. I would have to drop my membership level way down if diamond inns were to go in above me on the pages where I appear. As I mentioned before, it was this type of program (albeit an ill-conceived and ill-managed affair) that drove me to drop my state association membership two years ago. I will be interested to see how this is presented and executed. Will it help us all....or punish the little guys?

 

[gillumhouse]

Hey gang,
Let me apologize for being a bit off the forum. I won't go into my life story, but I've been up in my hometown in Wisconsin for a week helping out with some family things that came up. I don't have very good internet access, and have been extremely busy. I'll put together a much more extensive post on the flight home on Tuesday, but my quick thoughts while on someone's wifi connection I don't know...
There has been a lot of good feedback and ideas here though that I really appreciate.
Copper - very interesting ideas on letting B&B's distinguish themselves one way or another. I'd love to hear more on this as I think this could be something that could have some legs.
Gillum - I don't think consumers will look at other inns as "inferior," and that is something we discussed at quite a bit of length. There have been ratings and inspections done for a long, long time - whether from AAA, Mobil, SR. Some - read that some - consumers may migrate towards a AAA 4 Diamond or SR property, but many, many consumers do not - for some of the reasons like price as you mentioned. However, it has become clear lately with the launch of sites like Oyster, that professional reviews do have their place and popularity. Since we had nothing on our site that had this, we felt it important to at least have an offering that had professional reviews.
Innsider – thanks for recognizing our efforts on the professionalize image. We really do try hard on that. We do try to have the interest of all sizes of B&B’s at heart as we want to be as wide as possible in coverage for consumers. I know sometimes you guys don’t feel that way, and I do understand that. A great example of where I feel we did this, and didn’t get too many kudos is last year when we allowed Bronze level listings to have links directly if they were Weber customers. That is something that had no benefit at all to large properties, and hundreds of smaller properties took advantage of it. Clearly something that didn’t get us any extra money, in fact a lot less, and really impacted only a small group of smaller inns for the most part, although some were bigger. As far as numbers, I’m going to dig up average sizing info of our members when I get back to the office – happy to post it. Our average size property is about 8 rooms. I think the Median is a lot smaller than that actually (meaning a few large BB’s outweigh a lot more small ones in the average).
Briar – I think those are really good comments and issues. It would be fantastic if we all could agree on some common definition. I think it is very, very hard to do so in reality, but it would be great. .
Our goal at BB.com is to grow the number of people that stay at B&B's. I've seen reported numerous times that only 4% or so of travelers have stayed at B&B's. We'd like to increase that. Seems like more than 4% is reasonable. So we have been on a quest to convince consumers to stay at B&B's. Our mission in life is to take customers away from chain hotels and put them into small properties - period. If we do that, we feel like we succeed.
Now I understand our methods may not always win over every owner. I wish they did. So does Eric. Whether we are doing the right things or not, the jury is still out... however, I can honestly say that we are trying - we are putting forth every ounce of effort we have to get more people to stay at B&B's, and I think we have had some success doing it.
Again, apologize for being a bit offline, but I'll try to get back on in next 48hrs..

John, It was probably buried in the rest of my rant but I did acknowledge the link with Bronze & Webervations in each of my postings. I even said I had planned to go Bronze because of that link.
I do understand business and the need to grow business. As we have said, just make it a separate section, preferably a separate domain name because I do not see these "Diamond" properties s bed & breakfasts as we know them.

 

[JBanczak]

Hey gang -
Here is the link to the FAQ page btw which has a lot more answers on it: http://www.bedandbreakfast.com/Innkeepers/diamondcollectionfaq.aspx.
JB

 

[swirt]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours.

 

[muirford]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I agree, swirt - there is no logical business reason for bandb.com to spin off another website for their diamond inns. The only way it makes sense for them to enter this market is if they use the WEB marketing clout they already have - SR and R&C already have loyal customers in print, but are weak in the web marketing arena. Having a new and distinct website for diamond inns would lose them any advantage they are after in targeting the deep-pocket inns and boutique hotels.
They want to get the potential guest to bedandbreakfast.com, then show him/her the wide range of offerings they have. Even if the offerings are further and further away from what more than half of the B&Bs out there offer.

 

[aieechihuahua]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.

 

[muirford]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should.

I don't disagree that they should. But they won't. I'm sure this business expansion only makes sense web-wise if they can take advantage of the traffic they already have to bedandbreakfast.com. They are nothing if not about making the money. I have already dropped down to Bronze level with this directory and it doesn't seem to have hurt my business any. I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?

 

[wendydk]

Here is a question for John.....
In all of Northwest Michigan, there are very few Platinum Inns...I was the only one for more than a year, and now there is one other more than an hour away from me, but they are already closed and their website link goes to a parked page. Even the big hitters in the victorian romance department who market themselves relentlessly are gold members and below.
Is bb.com thinking that they will lure existing members to upgrade to Diamond, or are they trying to woo a certain segment of the Elegant Inns in the country that don't currently belong? Given that most won't even pay for Platinum, I wonder how they think anyone will upgrade to pay the really big bucks for Diamond status?
In the state of Michigan, there are about 20 platinum members, most of them clustered together in Southwest Michigan, where there is a preponderence of $1M+ Inns. Competition is fierce and cutthroat, because it's all for the same demographic...one goes Platinum, 15 go platinum. I could see areas like that getting alot of diamond members, but I don't know about the rest.

 

[swirt]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

You bring up some great points.
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"?
The answer to that is that the goal of internet marketing for a company their size (for what they have to offer us) is to be everywhere possible for every search.

 

[Samster]

I got the email too and frankly I wasn't surprised by it. It's a logical step for their directory to get into a listing of more "elite" B&Bs. A lot of us that are small won't even try to join this group for whatever reason. It will be interesting to see how it evolves.

 

[aieechihuahua]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should.

I don't disagree that they should. But they won't. I'm sure this business expansion only makes sense web-wise if they can take advantage of the traffic they already have to bedandbreakfast.com. They are nothing if not about making the money. I have already dropped down to Bronze level with this directory and it doesn't seem to have hurt my business any. I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
.

I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search, so the chances of me staying with them at the Gold level is pretty slim, if I stay with them at all. I feel like a sell out when I pay to play with the evil empire. They make me feel icky and dirty! (that was a joke. sort of.) Right now we are at the occupancy rate we want to be, so I have a lot to think about as far as marketing, and B&B.com will be the first to go.
If their compitition had any sense at all they would be taking advantage of this situation by making us all an offer we can't refuse for some quality yet equal internet merketing. I wish all the small to mid sized inns would just kiss off Bedandbreakfast.com, but that is as likely to happen as those NFL players that said they would leave their team if Rush became an owner holding to their word on that. Money talks, and people are not likely to shoot themselves in the foot over a principle. It's not the American way. I can hear the higher ups at BandB.com from here..."Screw them if they don't like it...what are they gonna do? Leave?" Probably not, and they know it. The self serving justification on this topic that one of their own gave on the PAII forum shows they think they are like manna from heaven to the B&B world, and we should all be thankful to throw our money at them and send all our customers to their site.

 

[JBanczak]

One of the things we have heard for quite some time now though is that consumers felt they needed to look elsewhere than BedandBreakfast.com to find luxury properties. That really doesn’t do any member of BedandBreakfast.com any good at all – if people don’t think they can get high-end properties on BedandBreakfast.com, then they’ll either never see our other properties, or think that none are high-end. This of course is a perception that we do not believe is a reality, but – as they say, perception is reality. So the question is – what are we going to do about it? How do we make sure consumers realize that BedandBreakfast.com does have the widest selection of properties, and they should come to us to see them all, not just the mid-range? So that is where we came up with the Diamond Collection. We feel that it is the answer to get more of the 96% of travelers who never stay at B&B’s. We think that consumers will be much happier with the now perceived wider selection on BedandBreakfast.com if it is clear there are all varieties of properties. Consumers will shop all properties though and find the one that is best for them – period. Just because we now have a broader perceived selection shouldn’t take away from properties that are not in that segment, and ultimately we think this will drive more consumers to the site in general. As for who do we think we join this program? We are not expecting that many inns to join - period - around 5%. We feel it is a niche product that is filling a void on BedandBreakfast.com, not a mass appeal product.
As far as your comments aieechihuahua, that's not the attitude we take at all. Quite frankly I'd love it if another directly stepped-up and did more in the industry. It would benefit us all if there were multiple sites out there trying to grab share from chain hotels. A lot of the time I think the other directories just sit back and laugh at us while they maintain a simple listing site without any headaches. They probably think we are crazy trying to maintain a business like Webervations or RezOvation, or go through a full external PCI audit, or manage a program like the one with Expedia and hotels.com, or that we spend so much money on advertising and press, or that we fed all of our content to Google Local almost four years ago. Having a straight-forward listing business where there is nothing to change or manage is obviously a lot easier and probably a lot more profitable!

edited by swirt to remove Microsoft formatting garbage]

 

[JBanczak]

Sorry for the format issues - Swirt - what am I doing wrong? It looks like I am just putting in plain text?

 

[wendydk]

One of the things we have heard for quite some time now though is that consumers felt they needed to look elsewhere than BedandBreakfast.com to find luxury properties. That really doesn’t do any member of BedandBreakfast.com any good at all – if people don’t think they can get high-end properties on BedandBreakfast.com, then they’ll either never see our other properties, or think that none are high-end. This of course is a perception that we do not believe is a reality, but – as they say, perception is reality. So the question is – what are we going to do about it? How do we make sure consumers realize that BedandBreakfast.com does have the widest selection of properties, and they should come to us to see them all, not just the mid-range? So that is where we came up with the Diamond Collection. We feel that it is the answer to get more of the 96% of travelers who never stay at B&B’s. We think that consumers will be much happier with the now perceived wider selection on BedandBreakfast.com if it is clear there are all varieties of properties. Consumers will shop all properties though and find the one that is best for them – period. Just because we now have a broader perceived selection shouldn’t take away from properties that are not in that segment, and ultimately we think this will drive more consumers to the site in general. As for who do we think we join this program? We are not expecting that many inns to join - period - around 5%. We feel it is a niche product that is filling a void on BedandBreakfast.com, not a mass appeal product.
As far as your comments aieechihuahua, that's not the attitude we take at all. Quite frankly I'd love it if another directly stepped-up and did more in the industry. It would benefit us all if there were multiple sites out there trying to grab share from chain hotels. A lot of the time I think the other directories just sit back and laugh at us while they maintain a simple listing site without any headaches. They probably think we are crazy trying to maintain a business like Webervations or RezOvation, or go through a full external PCI audit, or manage a program like the one with Expedia and hotels.com, or that we spend so much money on advertising and press, or that we fed all of our content to Google Local almost four years ago. Having a straight-forward listing business where there is nothing to change or manage is obviously a lot easier and probably a lot more profitable!

edited by swirt to remove Microsoft formatting garbage].

I hope that it does benefit all of us, and will remain positive about bb.com unless I see otherwise. Right now, as a platinum member, bb.com brings me nearly twice the traffic of bbonline and I know for a fact that the reservations program (and especially the partnership with expedia, hotels and travelocity) is the primary reason that years 6 and 7 have been our busiest ever in terms of both revenue AND occupancy.
So, thank bb.com, for your continuing efforts to bring more of the traveling public to Inns large and small!

 

[JBanczak]

One of the things we have heard for quite some time now though is that consumers felt they needed to look elsewhere than BedandBreakfast.com to find luxury properties. That really doesn’t do any member of BedandBreakfast.com any good at all – if people don’t think they can get high-end properties on BedandBreakfast.com, then they’ll either never see our other properties, or think that none are high-end. This of course is a perception that we do not believe is a reality, but – as they say, perception is reality. So the question is – what are we going to do about it? How do we make sure consumers realize that BedandBreakfast.com does have the widest selection of properties, and they should come to us to see them all, not just the mid-range? So that is where we came up with the Diamond Collection. We feel that it is the answer to get more of the 96% of travelers who never stay at B&B’s. We think that consumers will be much happier with the now perceived wider selection on BedandBreakfast.com if it is clear there are all varieties of properties. Consumers will shop all properties though and find the one that is best for them – period. Just because we now have a broader perceived selection shouldn’t take away from properties that are not in that segment, and ultimately we think this will drive more consumers to the site in general. As for who do we think we join this program? We are not expecting that many inns to join - period - around 5%. We feel it is a niche product that is filling a void on BedandBreakfast.com, not a mass appeal product.
As far as your comments aieechihuahua, that's not the attitude we take at all. Quite frankly I'd love it if another directly stepped-up and did more in the industry. It would benefit us all if there were multiple sites out there trying to grab share from chain hotels. A lot of the time I think the other directories just sit back and laugh at us while they maintain a simple listing site without any headaches. They probably think we are crazy trying to maintain a business like Webervations or RezOvation, or go through a full external PCI audit, or manage a program like the one with Expedia and hotels.com, or that we spend so much money on advertising and press, or that we fed all of our content to Google Local almost four years ago. Having a straight-forward listing business where there is nothing to change or manage is obviously a lot easier and probably a lot more profitable!

edited by swirt to remove Microsoft formatting garbage].

I hope that it does benefit all of us, and will remain positive about bb.com unless I see otherwise. Right now, as a platinum member, bb.com brings me nearly twice the traffic of bbonline and I know for a fact that the reservations program (and especially the partnership with expedia, hotels and travelocity) is the primary reason that years 6 and 7 have been our busiest ever in terms of both revenue AND occupancy.
So, thank bb.com, for your continuing efforts to bring more of the traveling public to Inns large and small!
.

I hope that it does benefit all of us, and will remain positive about bb.com unless I see otherwise. Right now, as a platinum member, bb.com brings me nearly twice the traffic of bbonline and I know for a fact that the reservations program (and especially the partnership with expedia, hotels and travelocity) is the primary reason that years 6 and 7 have been our busiest ever in terms of both revenue AND occupancy.
So, thank bb.com, for your continuing efforts to bring more of the traveling public to Inns large and small!

Thank you - that is very nice of you to say. Much appreciated,
John

 

[swirt]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should.

I don't disagree that they should. But they won't. I'm sure this business expansion only makes sense web-wise if they can take advantage of the traffic they already have to bedandbreakfast.com. They are nothing if not about making the money. I have already dropped down to Bronze level with this directory and it doesn't seem to have hurt my business any. I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
.

I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search, so the chances of me staying with them at the Gold level is pretty slim, if I stay with them at all. I feel like a sell out when I pay to play with the evil empire. They make me feel icky and dirty! (that was a joke. sort of.) Right now we are at the occupancy rate we want to be, so I have a lot to think about as far as marketing, and B&B.com will be the first to go.
If their compitition had any sense at all they would be taking advantage of this situation by making us all an offer we can't refuse for some quality yet equal internet merketing. I wish all the small to mid sized inns would just kiss off Bedandbreakfast.com, but that is as likely to happen as those NFL players that said they would leave their team if Rush became an owner holding to their word on that. Money talks, and people are not likely to shoot themselves in the foot over a principle. It's not the American way. I can hear the higher ups at BandB.com from here..."Screw them if they don't like it...what are they gonna do? Leave?" Probably not, and they know it. The self serving justification on this topic that one of their own gave on the PAII forum shows they think they are like manna from heaven to the B&B world, and we should all be thankful to throw our money at them and send all our customers to their site.
.

I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search,...
Just a word of caution (not specifically to you but to everyone tracking traffic) it is not enough to just look at traffic volume (visits or visitors). You have to look at conversion (done by using goals in analytics). Example:
In the past three months Google sent 62x more traffic to my site than bbonline but Google has only a 0.32% conversion rate while bbonline has a 6.2% conversion rate so it has 19x the conversion rate of Google.
You really need to compare the number of conversions to make sense of it.
(Visitors) x (conversion rates) = conversions

 

[JBloggs]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should.

I don't disagree that they should. But they won't. I'm sure this business expansion only makes sense web-wise if they can take advantage of the traffic they already have to bedandbreakfast.com. They are nothing if not about making the money. I have already dropped down to Bronze level with this directory and it doesn't seem to have hurt my business any. I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
.

I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search, so the chances of me staying with them at the Gold level is pretty slim, if I stay with them at all. I feel like a sell out when I pay to play with the evil empire. They make me feel icky and dirty! (that was a joke. sort of.) Right now we are at the occupancy rate we want to be, so I have a lot to think about as far as marketing, and B&B.com will be the first to go.
If their compitition had any sense at all they would be taking advantage of this situation by making us all an offer we can't refuse for some quality yet equal internet merketing. I wish all the small to mid sized inns would just kiss off Bedandbreakfast.com, but that is as likely to happen as those NFL players that said they would leave their team if Rush became an owner holding to their word on that. Money talks, and people are not likely to shoot themselves in the foot over a principle. It's not the American way. I can hear the higher ups at BandB.com from here..."Screw them if they don't like it...what are they gonna do? Leave?" Probably not, and they know it. The self serving justification on this topic that one of their own gave on the PAII forum shows they think they are like manna from heaven to the B&B world, and we should all be thankful to throw our money at them and send all our customers to their site.
.

I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search,...
Just a word of caution (not specifically to you but to everyone tracking traffic) it is not enough to just look at traffic volume (visits or visitors). You have to look at conversion (done by using goals in analytics). Example:
In the past three months Google sent 62x more traffic to my site than bbonline but Google has only a 0.32% conversion rate while bbonline has a 6.2% conversion rate so it has 19x the conversion rate of Google.
You really need to compare the number of conversions to make sense of it.
(Visitors) x (conversion rates) = conversions
.

re conversion rates:
and if you find search terms like "antique lamp" you can be assured they were not there to book a room.

 

[aieechihuahua]

With all the suggestions for a new separate website, I have to point out that in terms of promotion and traffic it would be a bad idea. It takes a lot of active promotion to get a new site to show up well. It would not be in the best interest of bandb.com to have one site that shows up well and then another inspected site that people are paying big bucks to be listed in sitting at page 4.
It would also not be in our individual best interests to have another directory (even if it had clout and integrity...as opposed to all the other startups we get spam from daily) gunning for a page one spot. There are only 10 spots on page one for any search. In most cases our own sites are competing with bbonline and band.com for the major terms .... trust me, you don't want another powerful directory snagging another page one spot....it just might end up being yours. .

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should. Just a link to these Diamond Collection inns from their own site would do the trick. B&B guests are not their target market, according to B&B.com themselves, and if this is true, than why are they putting these inns on the same page as the rest of us. This is what B&B.com said was the reason they created this group...
<Why did you launch the Diamond Collection?
BedandBreakfast.com’s mission is to take consumers out of large chain hotels and put them into smaller, independently owned properties. We feel we’ve done a good job of that over the years, but we heard from a distinct group of consumers who tend to stay at smaller luxury hotels and say they have had a hard time making the switch to B&Bs. Our goal of launching the Diamond Collection is to fill that void – to distinguish a select group of properties that tend to highlight that the B&B industry can cater to all types of travelers. Our hopes are that this helps to broaden the industry even more and get more and more people to consider a B&B the next time they travel.>
If they are targeting the distinct group of customers who tend to stay at small luxury hotels, than why would they be taking one of our spots on page one of an internet search for "anytown bed and breakfast"? that is not their target market, so they say
If they are creating an "exclusive club" I do not want it on the same page as my inn, I want it on a separate site. The current customer base at B&B.com have been loyal customers that will now pay for the privilege of being sat upon by an "exclusive inn". Is this in our individual best interest? As a Gold Member I am angry. If I was a Platinum Member I would be totally outraged.
On a search for a B&B in any given destination, upon landing on B&B.com's page for that desination you will first see "Diamond Collection Inns". Does that have the conotation that everyone NOT in that group is not worthy of it? Bad signal to send from my point of view, down the page a bit. Especially when B&B.com says this...
<First of all, you’re not just paying for a higher level – you’re part of an exclusive group of inns that represent the best of the best, from the inspection process to the checklist of required amenities.>
I'm sorry, but saying that is just not right. For one thing...because I can't afford to be a DIamond member has NOTHING to do with how fine my inn is. I have many more amenities than the list they require. And what does requiring us to paricipate in the Gift certificate program hav eto do with how fine an inn is?
How about this? <If you are an existing member, your listing will go live immediately at the Diamond level while your inspection is pending.> Wow! WooHoo! Pay enough money to take a shot at being at the top and you are there! Instantly! with no inspection. Now THAT's quality control! What a self serving crock of doo.
.

I disagree. They have the clout to spin off another site, and they should.

I don't disagree that they should. But they won't. I'm sure this business expansion only makes sense web-wise if they can take advantage of the traffic they already have to bedandbreakfast.com. They are nothing if not about making the money. I have already dropped down to Bronze level with this directory and it doesn't seem to have hurt my business any. I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
.

I doubt this is going away any time soon - as a Gold member, what do you think you will do next?
I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search, so the chances of me staying with them at the Gold level is pretty slim, if I stay with them at all. I feel like a sell out when I pay to play with the evil empire. They make me feel icky and dirty! (that was a joke. sort of.) Right now we are at the occupancy rate we want to be, so I have a lot to think about as far as marketing, and B&B.com will be the first to go.
If their compitition had any sense at all they would be taking advantage of this situation by making us all an offer we can't refuse for some quality yet equal internet merketing. I wish all the small to mid sized inns would just kiss off Bedandbreakfast.com, but that is as likely to happen as those NFL players that said they would leave their team if Rush became an owner holding to their word on that. Money talks, and people are not likely to shoot themselves in the foot over a principle. It's not the American way. I can hear the higher ups at BandB.com from here..."Screw them if they don't like it...what are they gonna do? Leave?" Probably not, and they know it. The self serving justification on this topic that one of their own gave on the PAII forum shows they think they are like manna from heaven to the B&B world, and we should all be thankful to throw our money at them and send all our customers to their site.
.

I am watching my website stats very closely. Right now B&B.com brings me the same amount of traffic as my local and state associations do, for a LOT more money. The big, big, biggest percentage of my traffic comes from google organic listings, and my position is right there with B&B.com on our city's b&b search,...
Just a word of caution (not specifically to you but to everyone tracking traffic) it is not enough to just look at traffic volume (visits or visitors). You have to look at conversion (done by using goals in analytics). Example:
In the past three months Google sent 62x more traffic to my site than bbonline but Google has only a 0.32% conversion rate while bbonline has a 6.2% conversion rate so it has 19x the conversion rate of Google.
You really need to compare the number of conversions to make sense of it.
(Visitors) x (conversion rates) = conversions
.

Thanks for the reminder, Swirt.

 

[JBloggs]

One of the things we have heard for quite some time now though is that consumers felt they needed to look elsewhere than BedandBreakfast.com to find luxury properties. That really doesn’t do any member of BedandBreakfast.com any good at all – if people don’t think they can get high-end properties on BedandBreakfast.com, then they’ll either never see our other properties, or think that none are high-end. This of course is a perception that we do not believe is a reality, but – as they say, perception is reality. So the question is – what are we going to do about it? How do we make sure consumers realize that BedandBreakfast.com does have the widest selection of properties, and they should come to us to see them all, not just the mid-range? So that is where we came up with the Diamond Collection. We feel that it is the answer to get more of the 96% of travelers who never stay at B&B’s. We think that consumers will be much happier with the now perceived wider selection on BedandBreakfast.com if it is clear there are all varieties of properties. Consumers will shop all properties though and find the one that is best for them – period. Just because we now have a broader perceived selection shouldn’t take away from properties that are not in that segment, and ultimately we think this will drive more consumers to the site in general. As for who do we think we join this program? We are not expecting that many inns to join - period - around 5%. We feel it is a niche product that is filling a void on BedandBreakfast.com, not a mass appeal product.
As far as your comments aieechihuahua, that's not the attitude we take at all. Quite frankly I'd love it if another directly stepped-up and did more in the industry. It would benefit us all if there were multiple sites out there trying to grab share from chain hotels. A lot of the time I think the other directories just sit back and laugh at us while they maintain a simple listing site without any headaches. They probably think we are crazy trying to maintain a business like Webervations or RezOvation, or go through a full external PCI audit, or manage a program like the one with Expedia and hotels.com, or that we spend so much money on advertising and press, or that we fed all of our content to Google Local almost four years ago. Having a straight-forward listing business where there is nothing to change or manage is obviously a lot easier and probably a lot more profitable!

edited by swirt to remove Microsoft formatting garbage].

John you prob need to stick your reply in notepad then ctrl-V to get rid of the extra junk in your post. give it a shot

 

[swirt]

Sorry for the format issues - Swirt - what am I doing wrong? It looks like I am just putting in plain text?.

You aren't really doing anything wrong. Its that other 600 lb Gorilla (Microsoft). They insist when you copy and paste that you want all kinds of nonsense formatting garbage to come with you. The formatting is all in hidden comments which this site doesn't show, but one of the comment tags gets eaten by the text filter in this software so some of the crap becomes visible. But then the WYSIWYG editor hides it so when you edit it and try to delete it, there is nothing to hilight so you can't delete it.
The only fix is for me to edit the source and make a note to myself to refine the filter